And welcome to everybody over on YouTube as we start another exciting edition of overtime off the hook over time
Where you can call us our phone number is eight zero two three two one four two two five eight. Oh two three two one hack and
We are
Basically continuing the conversation on
various issues
We are confirmed that we are on YouTube. That's always nice when we actually are broadcasting to people
and
We hope to to hear from from listeners, but yeah 5g, you know
That story we were reading I have to say
Was confusing and I think that's how a lot of people feel about these these technical issues Rob
Why do you keep giving me the thumbs up?
Really appreciate what you're doing, but also the levels on YouTube are a bit low
Here we go again, I yeah, I give up on this this this board that we have here keeps changing now the levels are low
I didn't change anything. So why the levels low? I don't want to touch it
I'm afraid to touch it if I touch it all the sudden things get distorted, you know
I was super distracted over the last hour because everything was changing on the board
So I couldn't hear myself or I could hear myself or I was distorted or as I was low
What do I do Kyle? Tell me what to do. I
think we need to
Turn up the auxiliary cheer. You're very low by the way. There's not enough cheer in our board
Okay, it's missing the the holiday cheer oh I sound better that's I just turned you up. Oh, that's good
I made a change. You told me not to make a change. I made a change sound better. I'll have a talk with it after
It's anyone has a mixing board to send us, please
We'll give you the PO box it needs more sugar and spice it needs
Kicking the ass is what it needs. It's it's not feeling festive right now
Well, someone say something while I'm doing something else
Well, it's it's still doing very well considering we lash this all up to together ourselves in our individual homes in a pandemic and the fact
That we can get out there
Without the radio airwaves to our listeners and take phone calls live on the air is
An example of something actually going really really nice for what it is and your your toils are appreciated
Thanks. Yeah, so I heard a ring. We got one test ring
so
The telephone system seems to still exist. So that that's encouraging. I'm feeling optimistic about that
So, do we have a caller no, they they sadly didn't try
Multiple times which we have that feature added on this phone line. I'm told let's go back to 5g since we were talking about that
Why not? Yeah, so we have these 5g phones that are arriving soon
And I don't I don't even know if we have a 5g network because I keep hearing conflicting stories
It's it's not being implemented till January or it doesn't work in certain parts of the world or
It's been in operation since last January. I don't know what to believe. I am also noticing these things about
devices
Being compatible versus certified. That seems to be a thing. Uh-huh. We have a call. I'm gonna answer that. Okay, go ahead and answer that
Let's see if we can put somebody on the radio
Let's see if we can put somebody on there on the radio volume is too low again
Volume's too low again. Okay, you know what Kyle you deal with rebel here and get the get the volume to be to the satisfaction
I'm getting all right
Yeah, I'll go. I'm gonna have a look. I'm trying. I'm really I
Thought I
Know I'm let me mention something about 5g rebel. We're trying to address you should instruct us. We're trying to address your concerns
So, please bear with us now while you're you know, even on phone you're you're a little bit low
I mean, I'm on the on the phone. You're a little bit low too. So I don't know I mean
You see here's here's what happens for people to understand what we're dealing with here
We have our microphones here in our studio pegged to the maximum
When we bring the Skype people in that affects the sound and brings us down
So now we have to go above the maximum somehow we can't
And if we if we adjust other knobs on the board, it gets all distorted and I hear my voice making some kind of a chant
What the hell are you doing?
We have a doorbell no, you just wait a ring doorbell. Oh, that's that's Robin Gila's door
Oh, I thought you did that to the board. Oh, well, they're very loud. Okay. So are we feeling better?
No, I this sounds better
Rebel, how do you feel about this? Yeah
You found a little bit louder and better
Wait, let me let me look on the channel. Let me go to the terminal and go to the term
I give it enough time to propagate so that you know, it takes time. The internet is not live
Yeah, it's a little louder on the computer a little lot. Look, can we can we be happy with a little louder?
Can we be happy with that just for tonight?
And talk about something I guess unless unless people hook their computers up to their stereos and maybe make it louder that way
Can we talk about hacker hearing loss?
Yeah, maybe it's maybe it's the listeners that aren't listening well enough
Huh, that's that that's the way to go. That's my theory. That's how you do it
I'm just getting a little defensive over here. I think you're too loud. Oh
I'm too loud now. Well, look at it this way. Let me just put this you had one
You had one green dot before now you have eight, okay, I don't know
Let's say it's working. Okay ish for now, but back to 5g
Okay, if that's what I was always told to strive for go ahead. What's your what's your yeah?
What do you got about 5g or anything? Um, let's see. All right. I have a 5g phone a Samsung 5g phone
I got it from T-Mobile
Okay, I
Download things I mean it I do speed tests on it and it says 100 megabits a second download and 30 megabits a second upload
or whatever, but you know sometimes when I'm
Like I go on whatsapp and download a file that somebody sends me it takes it's
Not very slow, but it could be a little faster
Like a one-minute video that somebody posted and I'll download it to watch it it takes like a
One minute but it does take
Quite a while not a while, but I'd say maybe a minute and a half
No, maybe less could it be adding a little bit because it's an encrypted conversation
possibly
Maybe and I guess the encryption makes it that'd be one guess I'd go with but are you sure you're using the 5g network?
Oh
Yeah, because I see it on my phone
okay, and when I tether and when I use tethering like when I use my phone as a tethering hotspot for my computer at home and
Go online. I
get the same good speeds download, but
When I'm watching it, let's say YouTube video
I get it'll sometimes buffer at like when I'm watching a high-definition video. I put it on like 480
It'll buffer less. I mean if it's I think it's the the latency is that the
the latency is like
13 or
18 or something like that or 20
But with 5g shouldn't it be less?
Yeah, I don't know I don't know maybe maybe Alex hasn't asked this because he's been using 5g as well, but
It's still susceptible. I think with I mean even
Wired connections optical and otherwise
Suffer from latency issues and wireless is I think no different
maybe even more so because it's going from various modes of communication and takes some time to be processed and in transit, but
but it
still may have a sort of
super
speeds and then
Suffer a little bit, especially when you're moving around, you know, I gotta say I don't know if 5g improves reception
But out of Long Island, there are so many problems with reception
Almost everywhere you go you lose reception and my phone
Lately, excuse me has been taking to alerting me every time
I'm out of signal range like every 10 seconds
it chimes a certain note and says sim not provisioned when it can't communicate with the with the carrier and
This is extremely annoying. I don't need an audible alert to tell me every 10 seconds that I'm not connected
I know I'm not connected or I don't care and it simply eats up the battery
I don't know if this is some some new feature that they've implemented or if my phone is just going
Well, it's a setting I didn't make I'll tell you that right now I
Think I also have a theory about this. This is the dilapidation. This is the shutdown
This is the end of the old network. They're not making more and better
coverage for the
Phone that you're upset about yeah, and and so anyway, that's not getting worked on. That's my theory
That's second. It's a good theory. It's it's built-in obsolescence. It's kind of funny that it's coming right before I get a new phone
But
If that's what they're doing
I kind of don't want to get a new phone now because this makes me want to double down and hold on to old technology
It just feels a lot like the whole landline conversation. We always have all over again. Oh, yeah. We're just gonna let the the copper
just corrode
Just for you know, like we're talking about
Getting on that subject or it's kind of similar you talk about the computer the network the that that floor or that
Bug that you were talking about the that long for J
Don't let you out. Why maybe if everybody should just go back to getting a mainframe and you know terminals and you know
Not be on the internet and whatever you want to put on the internet put it on a separate
System or not. I've still got the univac. I've still got the univac over at the warehouse
What do you mean why not if you say mainframe let's go for the mainframe univac
Yeah, we've got that we've got the power in a digital like IBM digital
Form you to remember the you don't know you ever do with a computer terminal company called informer that there was a they would
need terminals that like the Queensborough Public Library used to use and
They ran on the you know that digital equipment company mainframe. I believe I believe punch cards will make a comeback
I've invested heavily in their production and I think that is how we will communicate in the future. I
Just handed you a stack this morning prove me wrong
You can't do it. Can you?
No, well, maybe we should bring back TSPS operate
You know, I would like that. In fact, you know, I've been thinking since our conversation last week or a couple weeks ago
We were talking about communities running their own landline telephone companies. I think that's a good idea
How about you know all these all these elderly people wandering around with nothing to do how about they they they sit in the switch room
And they actually answer the phone and I know but I'm not supposed to Portland, Oregon. I'm not supposed to be in metal
Okay. Yes, some of them are running museums and things like that. That's true
But you know every every central office becomes a part of the community. I think there's something here now, of course, you know
You don't want to become soft switches now. I don't know what that well, you don't want your grandmother
You don't want your grandmother climbing up a pole
Unless she's really good at it to fix lines, but I'm sure we can work that out. Maybe you know
Outsourced to some kids or something. Well, they have like sure. Yeah
That's you know, just don't outsource it to anybody outside the country. They can use a bucket truck. They're not gonna use a ladder
Okay. All right. They've been around long enough. They know they're they're like, are there gonna be no more five ESS's and like
DMS-100 they can replace them with like like like voice over IP like soft switch type things
Software-defined networking future. Hey rebel. I don't know if you saw the latest 2600
but there's a terrific article in there about switches and I believe it covers 5 ESS and
And and DMS 100s and DMS 10s in the first part of it
Very very thorough. I was extremely impressed by this
hmm, there is a
successor to the
5ss7
signaling network and of course a lot of the equipment that
that
Utilized it including 5 ESS. So it will eventually be phased
Towards the older side. It'll be harder to find them I guess but not yet
So what about the wired like I like businesses like stores and businesses you've wired? Yeah, that's that's a good point
I was I was actually thinking about that because most places most
Establishments still have landlines for you to call in and make an order the other day
I was trying to reach a place to place an order and there was something haywire about their phone
it was picking up giving the name of the place playing music saying somebody will be with you soon and
Nobody ever came and I kept calling back and the same thing would happen
Then I I called a second time on top of the first time thinking that I might jump over and I did and I got
Somebody with a very faraway voice that was cutting in and out saying our phones are broken. I said, okay
I'll come down place the order in person when I got there
It was so sad because they had no way of communicating with their customers and and nobody could call in to place an order
I didn't get to the point of saying show me your phone line. I'll fix it for you
I just wanted to you know, get my food and get out of there, but
Sometimes people have these things installed that just don't work and they're at they're at their mercy
So, I don't know if if they they moved away from their landline to do this or I don't know why they couldn't just pick
up the phone it just seemed like you should always be able to do that and the fact that they weren't able to do that
Tells me that they they opted for something cloud-based or just something. That wasn't a very good idea. That could really hurt them
So you can do that with your own phone?
Like if I'm not I if I wanted to get a home phone line
I was really thinking of doing it, but why would I pay the extra money if I have a cell phone?
Because if I get a regular seven-digit phone may ask what part of the country you're in at this moment
Well, I'm in New York City now, you're in New York City, California
well when the floods come you can tell us by California later, but when the floods come or a hurricane or a blizzard or
Just you know uprising one sort or another and there's no power for a couple of months
Or even a few weeks and the cell towers are down. How are you gonna communicate? How you gonna charge your phone?
What are you gonna do landline? You can pick up them get dial tone and talk to whoever still left
That's true. That's why well, yeah, I guess it'd be worth it, you know, just to get basic service, you know
Or I can you know, just call the operator. They all springing, you know, what?
Begin to collect calls. Let's remember the
Shenanigans at the collect call that I would make to my cell phone and not to get a bill
Then when I tell you about them
refresh my memory
I'm doing 1-800 collect right which they would say we can make a like off the cell phones and you'd make a call
I call to your cell phone and then you know, I would think my my mighty mobile bills were spent PCS
Would get the bill I get it on the bill. I paid you know $10 for the minute
I talked or whatever and but no that never happens keep calling you
They keep they call you saying this is the wire max tell with
Reminding you about your collect call
With I was placed on whatever you pay with a credit card
We sent to your card that they want a credit card of it. So, of course, I you know didn't
You know answer and they just keep calling you saying and then the price keeps going up
I think it was like thirty dollars twenty dollars or something. That was like thirty dollars or something. I don't we call them
Yeah, we did a whole thing
I was that was a different company, but but I have never seen a collect call work to a cell phone
Properly, I've never seen that. I mean
That's what I thought is that tell me if I'm wrong about this
But there has never been a phone book of cell phones ever
I keep hearing that there's going to be but you know, he's gonna call the optical
He's gonna call information and ask for you know
Can I have rebels phone number and she'd say sure here it is you want his address too and they'd be very
Informative and helpful. You can't do that anymore. You can't do that with cell phones
How do you how do you find out somebody's phone number if you don't already maybe I should put my cell phone as unlisted
I don't know how you can even do that because I think they're all unlisted by default. I probably have to pay to do that. I
Don't know why there isn't
You know since we had a phone book in the past and since we're a more intrusive society than ever before
Why do we let that go? Why do we say, you know, I
Called Verizon and asked him can I get a phone book and they said, um, you're gonna have to call this number about it
And you know, I called another number which is not Verizon, which was some company that
Something about phone books. I don't know
They do something I don't know probably more than that, but I don't think I could
Yeah, you know what what you can you can get a good price for old phone books these days if you have a phone book
Save it and and and you can sell it. I'm just trying to start something here
I don't really know if that's true on eBay. Yeah, sell your phone book on eBay. I have a
1983 Suffolk County phone book. It's yours for 50 bucks. Try that see what happens
You're worried. You go to the public library, New York City Public Library and look at all the phone books
Yeah, they have a whole floor devoted to phone books. No, I'm kidding about that, too. Is there a
microphone
Is there a hacker phone book of like every single phone phone number that has been explored
That's that ever has that in there. Was that ever compiled anywhere though?
Well, every hacker has their own that's got scribbles and crossouts and things like that. I don't know if they've ever been compiled
Wow, I just thought of some I think the FBI has tried to bring that I
Would just when the remembering a time when you used to call back in the 90s the operator you would say I like the rates
Calling at two one two, three nine four exchange and she would just dial it and say oh that's local or whatever back in the
TSP FBA days
they would have to dial a certain did like one for one or whatever just and then get a
Recording that said rate step one one or whatever and then that would mean to look in her table and remember that voice
It would be rebel. Do you remember that voice that voice was so computerized sounding? I
Really would say wait step one one
Yeah, that's a very good imitation that's a very good and somewhere I'm one of my old radio shows
I know we have a recording of that. But yeah, that was that was something else
It was like the way you would picture a voice computer sounding in the 1950s
Yeah, and they also like when you call like our phone number would be would begin with a nine like the the suffix would begin
with a nine
nine nine nine nine no one but like nine eight seven two, so
If being that no, I back in the 60s and 50s pay phones used to have nine as the
beginning a number of a suffix usually I would call collect to my house
Let's say an operator would have to verify that that wasn't a payphone even though, you know
Indifference in the 70s. So and they would they would call you. She would they would call the coin box, by the way a
Coin idea, but it would say that it repeat that it or a coin repeat
You know, you should lead a symposium rebel on what all these recordings used to say I think there's an audience
Yeah, I remember that but remember when it got back in the Dell system days, please
They used to when you used to like paid up dime for a phone call for five minutes and then when it collects
They give you five minutes for another five cents would be like a penny a minute. So basically they would say
Yes deposit five cents for the next five minutes, are you call me interrupted?
Thank you. This is a recording. They would interrupt the coin
If you didn't put the coin in the pipe that it would interrupt it start clicking and muting the sound
But you could still hold on a conversation
You could have people shouting and trying to distract you and everybody in the phone company would pitch in and just try to get you
Off the phone, but that way but then you could not use a red box for those that that was a different kind of time
Yeah, I was local over time
Right, but that was and then the one when the phone company broke up and then when nine X
But you know became the local company then they said
Excuse me, please deposit 10 cents for the next few minutes. What do you call will be terminated?
Wow, that's significantly more expensive, isn't it?
Yeah, I may just disconnect the call and they don't interrupt it anymore they just would disconnect you, uh-huh
I don't even know what they do now. I haven't made a payphone call in a long time
I you know, I'm always I don't even know where there's payphones at all. I mean they're removing payphones like
Everywhere so and the paper that are still around don't work. Uh-huh. I always well, you know, I want to preserve them
I have not actually used one. Of course, it's hard to use one
But I should try that I should find a working pay phone put a quarter in it make a call and see what happens when
My time there is a working pay, you know, I think on like Broadway. No, not probably
Amsterdam no, it's on the west side somewhere Manhattan on like West End Avenue in like 68th Street or 72nd Street or something
It's like one of those Canadian type phone booths with a Verizon payphone inside. Well, it's not really Verizon people, but it's
I
Don't know still there. I mean well
I keep hearing rumors of old payphones inside restaurants that the phone company has lost track of and there's still
Rotary dial and might even have the wrong area codes because you know cutovers and expansionary codes and things like that
We're put into play. I don't know if that's true. But if you know, I
See it and take a picture of it
I
Mean I pictures of phones from like the 19, you know late 80s early 90s. Mm-hmm
We got to carry coins with you and
You know, it's a key you think everything's more efficient these days you can be difficult
You don't exactly carry cash and coins, you know, you get somebody, you know
It's a dollar fifty seven for for this candy bar and then you get all this changes
That's rattle and then when you sit down it falls out of your your pocket and you know
Is that what a candy bar cost a dollar fifty seven really
Yeah, we said we saw when we were when we were at st. John's we saw a robotic a vending machine
That basically, you know how sodas used to just sort of fall from when you select them
No, this arm comes gets it
I'm wondering what why why do you need a robot arm to do this?
Why can't you just push it off the edge like you used to it's one more thing to break down
But I was fascinated by it. It's it's amazing vending machine technology, you know a long way
Thank John's and I I'm I'm a bicycle right away from st. John's. Well, then I hope we'll be seeing you at hope
In July. Oh, you mean this summer? Yes this summer. Yeah, that's gonna make coming to the conference
I remember back in 1980s in 1988 or something
I went to this job fair at the juror at the Jaffa Center and New York telephone 9x New York telephone
With I guess we're hiring operators something and I just knew this was they were showing the
top
Console or the computer whatever I just remember. I don't remember it. I remember it very vaguely. I mean, I wish I would have you know
Gone into a more of it
But I remember looking at it and remember being there being a phone number. I guess it was a display
It wasn't a LED display
But it was a regular I guess computer monitor display and a phone number was on the upper left-hand corner
I don't you know
It was just a phone number and I remember seeing the buttons of the keyboard there and I said, you know
Where's like position release and all that and you know, I was playing with it
I know the operator and you know, she's just the guy was just saying no where this is what the operators use and
You should have you should have applied you would have made an interesting operator an interesting
You know, I did go take the New York did the test for the phone company?
I remember but I don't think I was like quick and I you gotta be like
You have to type a certain number of words a minute and and be a pro, you know
I don't know could we give I don't know if I'd be good
But you got to be quick a certain way and and not take apart the console to figure out what it does
right, I
Was thinking the exact same thing a manual that rebel would have made I think the most interesting
Telephone operator in the New York telephone system there. You could have made quite a splash that rebel. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely
And now there are no operators. Actually, then there might be operators still somewhere actually there wait
There's operative but there in other well the operators that you when you call 1-800 call 80 not calling to be
1-800 collect when you call that that's in another country. I
Guess or in India, but I was in a hotel in Florida
at Walt Disney and
I call I
Called the operator just to see what it is. It was AT&T, you know, and so, you know, it was a regular AT&T operator
Just I just you know, so I want to go to California. I'll do the same thing. That's where they are Disney World
That's where all the operators wound up
Yeah
Interesting in a long when I go to California. I'll play with phones more. All right. All right, you keep dropping this hand
You're going to California. Are you going to California rebel?
Yeah in January. Okay. All right. Are you coming back?
I
Well, yeah, I hope well, I'm coming back, but I hope because I am coming back
The Brooklyn Dodgers never came back. The New York Giants never came back. You know, they go out there. They just stay it and
Well, I like that. Well, I don't I mean I'd like to stay for the winter and maybe come back in like March or April
They don't have winter there. So you wouldn't be staying for the one thing. I'd like to stay for the winter
I stay for he's gonna wait out
You basically want to go into suspended animation and miss our winter and live in whatever they call that season over there
right
By all means no safe travels and all that, but
Remember when you called Drake's dad, you know that there was a there was this
Yes, this resort up in like Northern, California up in like the mountains like north of like Sacramento
They didn't get where they didn't get own incoming phone calls or something
They had to go to an operator get incoming phone calls or something like that
How does that work? I just know you wound up speaking to an operator and you'd have to say
The name of the place I like toll station number. I like Drake's very toll station. Number two, whatever Drake's bad seveners are. Yeah, right
It's a good place to be
I like Drake's very toll station. Number two, whatever Drake's bad seveners are. Yeah, right
And that would correspond to whatever phone number and then they'd call them or something
And I'm a little going there like oh like 15 20 years ago
Maybe and then just playing with their phones at that place and croaking to an operator in Susanville, California
There are there are still independent phone companies in various places
If you if you find them, we saw a couple when we were driving back across the states last month
You know that they might be very interesting places to get tours of
Right, but what did they have pay phones? How did you know they were independent?
We saw we saw a building that said local town
Yeah, not necessarily smaller than that yeah like Bob I
Mean here in New York this frontier and I think that's
I
Think so. So yeah, the Drake's bad thing and then the operator and didn't Verizon take over
GT it took over the Connecticut company there, you know, like Verizon
Yeah, it's net as the Southern New England telephone. That's right
I
Missed those days where every state had their own Bell of Pennsylvania and C&W
Companies are like they're like, you know small town
phone and
Internet or whatever, you know, and that's where people will get their their DSL. I'm just kidding a wireless or
Local contract and it's rural or maybe off the beaten path in a place where there aren't a lot of customers
so they're able to just kind of pool together people that are
that have a vested interest in communicating are planning on connecting up and and running a business or
communicating and it's a practical way to
to get a
Bulk purchase and and keep people connected and not so distant while they're physically removed Rob
Did you have something to say?
Yeah, just a quick point of trivia GTE and Bell Atlantic merged and that's where we got Verizon. Oh, that's what happened
They formed together and created Verizon
Wow, and of course Bell Atlantic swallowed 9x at one point and we became Bell Atlantic for a little while
Do you remember that? Do you remember those days when we were Bell Atlantic here? Oh, yes
Yeah, if anybody knows anything about running a cooperative telephone company we would like you to write
oth at
2600 comm or call in we're really interested in how
co-op or nonprofit telephone companies work and
What it would take even such a nonprofit telephone company. Yeah a 501 c12
Yeah, definitely
Utility company that's a nonprofit. Yeah. Yeah. It's a cooperative telephone company. We're very interested in that specifically running a 501 c12 and
How how it how hard it is or what kinds of things you encounter in your community?
We're really interested in what kinds of things are going on, you know, I've seen this in in northern Canada people pooling resources
Getting getting high-speed internet and stuff. So if you're doing this kind of project
We want to hear about hear your story. I feel like we're
We're hurtling towards a Green Acres episode and if you've never seen it
there's a series of episodes actually where they run their own phone company and
They're climbing poles and and fixing all kinds of problems and dealing with the Public Futility Commission
yes, the Public Futility Commission it actually is really well done and
I
Guess I guess that might be the world. We're heading towards. I you know, it's not a bad world to be honest
It's running on phone company. Well, if the alternative is is this giant?
thing that that is
Impersonal and has absolutely no it's just a giant computer with with employees
Like you know is what that's some kind of a worthwhile trade-off
I mean, I don't actually mind the smaller more approachable one if if I can't get much other than
carrier jargon out of the larger one again the
Post-apocalyptic scene of like the massive computer that doesn't care and the barren landscape. There's something kind of appealing about that, too
I don't know. I'm torn. I'm torn between the homespun charm and the futility of it all
I think there's aspects of both, you know, and and a huge giant
spectrum of gray area in between
That's our brains. Oh, yeah
Doesn't it cost like a couple of million dollars to do this?
Money is no object because we don't intend on paying for anything. Yeah, we don't use dollars. Yeah, that's that's so last-century
Alex what did you have here? I
Wanted to chime in here about this because it I had this this proustian moment and talking about telephone companies and
You know run by the community and things and and and I thought back to this
this
Experience I had in law school in in Vermont. I went to law school in Vermont
I have another law degree from the UK as well, but in Vermont
the
My second year I was moving to a new town and have you ever heard of Norwich?
University has anybody ever heard of that in Vermont sounds vaguely familiar. I believe it exists. I believe it's there
It could be there. The thing that's interesting about it is it's actually it's a military Academy. It's a private military Academy
That's a university
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait a private military. Can you miss a different military than the US military mercenary school?
Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, it's a military Academy, but it but it's it's run private which military which which military do they do they help?
The United States military. Yeah, that's right. Yeah
Alright, this is it is a hundred twenty-five years old. I think no, I'm sorry. It's not 125 years old. It's about
110 years old. I think it's like 1819 or something was Norwich University, but I think that Northfield is where
Okay, so there's another town in Vermont called Norwich Norwich University, of course does not exist in Norwich, Vermont
Norwich, Vermont is actually closer to Dartmouth
but Northfield Vermont is the site is of
Norwich University and
I almost lived there and I almost actually took a teaching gig there and I remembered something really specific about Northfield, Vermont
They run their own telephone company. Do they call it the Norwich telephone company? No, it's not Norwich
Well, I get I want to get past this confusion with the name Norwich University is in Northfield
Did they just confuse themselves? Are they trying to confuse us? I think so
Yeah, but so in this weird little, you know enclave that's sort of like a tiny little country military town
I love those
country military
But but it is the Northfield Telephone Company. I remember seeing this
I remember talking with people about it when I almost lived there. I decided not to take the house in Northfield
and move into Montpelier, but
It is the Northfield Telephone Company and I just looked it up
And and Kyle this will answer some of your questions, too
This is the business description is that the Northfield Telephone Company, which also operates under the name
Inexplicably TDS. It doesn't describe what TDS stands for
Is located in Northfield, Vermont this organization operates primarily in the telephone communication except radio business
Communication sector and has been operating for approximately 125 years
Northfield Telephone Company is estimated to generate
2.3 million dollars in revenue and annual revenues and employees approximately
How many people do you think are employed there? I'll tell you let's do an over-under here. How many people what's what's the what's the approximate population in this place?
Well, just feel is it a village is it is it a village is it a
City what I'm guessing five. I think there's like 6,000 people in the town. All right, you six to 10,000
It's got to be smaller than I'm going to take Kyle's a bed of five and undercut it and say three
Rob Gila, you have any any bets there? I
I have no horse in this race and
People working now rebel says ten one dollar
Okay, I will I will say 15
15 and Gila's walked away. So okay. Yeah, what's what's number Alex? So you said five?
Kyle Emanuel you said three. That's right. Rebel said ten and and and what'd you say again Rob? I said 15 15
Okay. So what is it?
the inimitable and
And brilliant winner here is none other than then rich the rebel who is
It's actually eight only eight people work there
eight employees
That's all it takes
That's that's you know, that's that's 16
Part-time people working halftime, right? That's you know, and and you can just go from there
It's absolutely amazing. It takes
Switches and and the wires and things like that and and and and and and and and and and and and and and and and and
And the wires and things like that and Alex is Northfield Telephone Company in Vermont still exists. I think it does
Well, they don't have a Wikipedia page. I just looked it up
What's oh, it doesn't really I can't find it unless it's called something else. So there are
There's TDS fiber I'm seeing here, I don't know if it's the same thing
I get known as TDS. How do you get TDS and Northfield Telephone Company?
It's
You have to google it and it'll come up and under the gun in Bradstreet. I guess it's there. Oh
Wait a Northfield. No, they don't have a website, but
They don't have a website
No, it's just it's just actually it's not a website it's just
To go to done in Bradstreet. You just Google Northfield Telephone and it'll come up done in Bradstreet
Would you like a from do not say done in Bradstreet one more time, please?
I know there's some financial like I say they wait
They're just saying that that they existed in in one point in time ever
I would just comment
Yeah
it both surprises me and sort of contradicts what I'm gonna say that there are a lot of tools to running these kinds of things
think about
How much you can do to register someone on online now versus?
Years and years ago where you would have a lot of paper forms and filling out things
And so to that end and running a small
Company like this you would have to deal with customers you would have to deal with repairs and stuff like that
But I think maybe there's answers in all number answers in
You know how contractors fit in or or if you know, because do they need to have full-time installers necessarily?
Or do they structure?
That type of problem in a different way than what we've seen for so many years with other forms
I'm we're just curious. I think this is fascinating and there are so many of them the fact they don't have a website
I digress it both surprised me and doesn't in fact, why would they need one? Maybe it is such a small
user base that it's something that people just walk down the street and go in and handle their business in person or something I
Think I might want to go up there and see if they still exist
Not gonna door and see what who answers they have a phone number. Yeah, Alex road trip
What do you say? Yeah, yeah
I
Knew people that were involved in small telephone companies and were able to just like a lot so many people are doing now
We're able to work remotely and you know, maintain that network wherever they were. So it's I'm sure just like any other
Utility business these days just on a very micro scale
Rebel we've been talking to you for over 40 minutes and I maybe maybe want to let another caller get in
So it's it's been fun. That's been really enlightening and a good trip down memory lane and memory bullet
Yeah, they have a phone number. Would you like their phone number the Northfield Telephone Company? Yeah. Sure. Why not?
We're all about giving out information. Let's immortalize it. Yes. I don't know if it's still work
So it's area code 8 0 2 and I told you that 4 8 5
9 7 8 4 9 7 8 4 be nice there at that
124 deposit
Depot square. I don't know if this is accurate Alex. You're calling them
You just made a phone call with your with your cell phone. Anybody else calling? Please be I was calling them
It's the holidays. They might be Alex's call. I'm trying to get Alex to say something here. Yeah, what what you find out?
But well, oh, you're calling them live. Okay, I'm their Christmas party
Okay, sorry now you gave out the guy's name who runs the phone company
We just docks Peter go
Wow, I'm not trying to make make frenemies in the in the small telco game
It could be the highest telephone executive they've ever reached though. Think about that
It would be interesting if that was actually rebels arch enemy
Uh-huh, and he just gave out their phone number for no reason. Yeah, exactly. Oh, we'll find out
So rebel we're going to disconnect now as the operators would say and
Have a fun trip out there and
Yeah, well, I'll call in of course. Yeah, absolutely. We don't try
Well, depending on where I want to be done, let's see
No, no, no, no
Wow, well that was something maybe we should have 45 minute calls with each caller I
Enjoyed talking to us. It's great to hear
It's it's so much so many different conversations there and that is that's the very nature of discussion. That's why we do this
Well, it's good to remember the things that used to be and some that still are and and might be in the future
Well, there's people out there that know about what is they just can't call
Well, someone's calling now, that's such a wimpy ring, yeah, why don't you make it louder
We have a landline here that isn't very enthusiastic about being a landline not in the holiday spirit, okay
Go ahead. You're on the radio. I know you're on off the hook overtime
Attempts to keep my copper line
Sounds like you've kept it. Yeah, go ahead. Ah, well
it's still at the
my
Let's see Brad
Women's office is
Advising me to play for time while they try and see if they can do anything
Okay, no, who is this who's advising you Brad Hoylman and who is that elected official you you found somebody that is
Amazing. Wow, that is great. And and
What is this person elected as?
What are they
Okay, but what are they an assemblyman a senator what I think the state senator I believe senator
I don't know. I don't know every elected official
Well, this is just it's just good guidance
For other listeners who might have the same problem if you got a response by this particular elected official
I'm gonna look them up. What's what's name again?
Brad Hoylman, okay. They also directed me to the New York utility project
Which I left phone messages, but nobody's gotten back to me. Apparently
they've had an overwhelming pressure of
Emergency calls I
wonder why
Now herein is the connection. Uh-huh
Well Brad Hoylman, by the way is a New York State Senator. So I think you've you've definitely hit the right combination here. So
Contact your state senator and they might be as responsive as Brad Hoylman has been so far
So anyway, I'm supposed, you know on January 1st. I will
call them up and
arrange for
You know Fios at the latest possible date playing for time
Which is not exactly, you know a breakthrough
It depends how much you can string them along for
Invariably they want to schedule something out, you know, they'll schedule something you can be unavailable for like indefinitely that's true
Or you know away for a long time
Well, I
Think they're gonna want to do it some at some point, but since they're switching everybody else over
Also, maybe they won't be in such a particular hurry about me
Who knows well if you can find any other people that feel the same way that employ the same tactics
Then becomes a pain for them and use the time
continuing to
You know call out
Here and and just finding other resources getting allies and getting
Some other avenues to pursue use that copper line to help save that copper line
Well, I was just filling out a general inquiry form
contacting the office of public the public advocate I
Don't know whether the public advocate can do anything, but I guess it can't hurt can't hurt
Contact as many people as you possibly can and you might really find the solution to this
I'm doing my best and you're doing well, you're doing really well and
Hopefully inspiration to many. I hope that maybe you could act fast and
Have put you throw up your copper landline company really quick
I can be your first
Yeah, well, you know imagine the local company for a New York City for Chelsea
Yeah, that would be you know, you'd have your work cut out for you, but it'd be interesting. Oh
Oh, let me let me do a shout out also on on the once a month
meetings of
2600
Let me encourage people to try the zoom one
Because this last time I was
All alone and Lauren, so I hope somebody else will say hi to next time. We had we heard reports
I don't know about Rob might have an update that it is still available, but it is underutilized
Yeah, it's been it's been utilized less and less since we started doing meetings in person again
But I have a feeling the news being what they are now
And the situation being what it is, I think more people are going to be interested in
using in attending the
2600 meeting remotely. Yeah, I think in a couple of weeks. Yeah, I think we should just say here right now
2600 meetings enjoy the holiday stay at home for January just you know this this one month
Let's all just play it safe because you know, the Omicron is going nuts and let's reconvene in February
I think that makes more sense
It does make sense
Drastically different every day trending toward doom
but I I would say yeah
Keep keep an eye on the numbers and everything going on where you are and be safe above all else and we will definitely still
be doing the virtual
components of the meeting this time around and
We'll see it. Well, we'll go from there
Something else that's interesting though completely unrelated but right at the day after the 2600 meeting which would be on January 7th
January 8th is WBA eyes birthday
It will be its 62nd birthday. Wow, how about that? But now, you know something else you said that just sort of touched
January 7th is the day after the meeting which means the meeting is on January 6th
The January 7th is is the Friday. It's okay. All right. Thank God. I just didn't want the meeting to be on January 6th
No, no, I know one year it will be but not not so soon everybody stay home that day
Thanks, okay, I've got I've got two years no one year. Oh my god, it's coming up
All right caller I hope things work out thanks for updating us
Thank you, please call back
When you know more next meeting on zoom, yes, definitely fantastic. We'll see you there. Bye. Bye. Have a great holiday. Bye
Our phone number 8 0 2 3 2 1 4 2 2 5 8 0 2 3 2 1 heck
I have a few minutes left. If anybody else is out there wants to say hi. We'd love to hear from you
Tell us about your phone company idea
Why do you sound like you're on the phone now? Somehow you lean am I into your microphone? I don't know. Everything's crazy
I haven't touched anything on the board. By the way, I haven't touched that thing
I was I was afraid we might get a squeal I keep leaning on this table
Hang up sometimes you get a squeal but didn't do that. I think it's low enough where it doesn't squeal. Oh, yeah
There that's fine. I can do that
I think those some of those channels are out of phase and they're like you think they're competing with each other because what was your first?
Clue well, it's because we're looping back to the people who are remote and it's not really the best
It's not mixing them out when they when they get something fed to them
Mixing all of us up. I have no idea how any of it. It's just magic
It's just a spaghetti of wires and then you went and added turntable channels on top of everything else now we have turntables
You don't like turntable. I'm just saying everything we add makes it more
No, crazy and and and it's a combative board. It tries to hurt us and and and distort our words
Yeah, I could do some scratching. I'm not disagreeing with it may be conservative on the other show somehow
They have two turntables and a microphone. No, no, I've been on we're exactly so so it's
It's open phone line here, I think not anymore. No, it's a busy phone line. Yeah
Eight zero two three two one four two two five the phone is on the hook now so you can call
and
Maybe we can fix that ringer too. So the phone sounds more like a phone this one. Yeah, this this phone's
It's being re
Rebuilt. Yeah, it sounds like something someone stepped on rehabilitated. It's
It it came from a broken
Situation and that's my grandparents old phone, isn't it?
Did they live in the two one two? Well before it became seven one eight and the seven eight four exchange
Yeah, that's that's my grandparents phone. Is this using right now?
Read that no I have had as a child I would call that phone from my house and talk to my grandparents
How awesome is that that we're using that particular? That's the style boy
Of course the bell did sound better back then we can we can fix that
I think that's the muted mode
I hear a siren. Do you hear that?
That's ours. Okay. I was wondering how the phone was generating a siren Kyle
Maybe you want to pick up the phone so that we can talk to the person I did
I'm holding the phone was still ringing. I heard still. Oh, you want to pick up the line?
Yes, that's what I mean by pick up not physically pick up the phone for God's sake
Lose the caller no, they stopped calling
I was trying to mess up calling because you may ring 20 times
Pick up the phone. You're the only person in the world when you say pick up the phone
You literally pick up the phone
I was messing with you and I and you wound up messing with some innocent person
well, I said that because I was trying to adjust the
The ringer and that required me to pick up the phone. Please call back. Does it feel good Kyle?
Does it feel good knowing that ruining everything changed somebody's plans for tonight? I'm sorry, you know
It's a good exercise for your dialing
digits, maybe they were calling to say they were in trouble and that they needed help and
We were the people who could help them and we're here for you. We are here for you. We'll answer all your questions about
Telephones about logs in
Java and
You know all the operating systems if you have a mobile phone with a real-time operating system
let us know if you if you're upset at your microkernel and
You're trying to negotiate with it. We can help you through that. We're good counselors
The phone is ringing again
Hello, and it's coming from Vermont actually in telecall operator. This is rebel so you can just
Disconnect that right away
That was me, I mean that was you it was me saying if you're upset with your microkernel
Oh, someone just recorded the show and I see yeah. Well, are there listening on a rebel you on for 45 minutes?
Please don't call us now. Thanks for that. Give us one else a chance
Listening on YouTube and they're just in the delay
That's true 8 0 2 3 2 1 4 2 2 5 is our telephone number you can call that direct 8 0 2 3 2 1 hack and
We'll be on for another five minutes or so after which time we will stop
Yeah, well while we're while we're waiting tell us a little bit more about this telephone because the listeners can't see it
I'm looking at it and it's very pretty. Oh, it's beige. It's a it's a rotary phone. Is that a Western Electric?
Yeah, of course. It's a Western Electric. This is a
1976 500 DM I
Don't know if you can see a year on it anywhere. Yeah, it says
1176 1976 actually, I'm assuming that's the year. Well, maybe that was one of the newer phones that they got
Bell system property, right? Was it still property? Oh, really? I
Mean it might say that
you know how much is owed on this then if it's a monthly lease and
Okay. Well, I'm not responsible for it. Okay. I just it was in a box and it took it. It's
It's got some broken parts, I put a really long it's modular. So yeah, that's what that's a newer phone
Yeah, I it didn't have a handset. I found a handset that sounds. All right, and then the corded modular I fixed the
the terminations on the handset cord, but
Want like the part of that that connects to the side of the phone is a little broken
So it's a little wobbly and you know, it needed a little care and that's why the ring was off
Do you want to speak to Bobson? Hello Bulgaria Bobson? Come in. Do you think over time? How you doing Bobson? Good to hear you
Pardon good to hear you where we're exchanging pleasantries. I
Was gonna tell Alex that I managed to get a bottle of class
But you're not gonna do that anymore you you were gonna tell him
Why not just
So, did you try it Bob said I'm so curious as to your observations
Well, I tried some of it. It's
It's
To me it tastes like
Beer that was successful or something like that. It's made you all hyper too. I mean, wow, I could see the difference
Yeah
Being that it's a fermented
Beverage. So yeah, I imagine it's it's like partially fermented because there's no alcohol
Is that is that correct Alex or Bobson? I don't know
Got it
Too low to be considered there's something around in Europe that's called small beer
which is
beer with low levels of
Kinder beer. Okay. Yeah like ciders. Yep
Yep, low alcohol very very low alcohol
I think it's getting more popular people have been and a lot of the hard seltzers out there, but there are it's true
I mean, there's so many types of
Brewed beverages. I'm thinking birch beer and root beer and all of those kinds of low or non-alcoholic
But they seem to be popular. So this this is a good test. So Alex you tried this, right? You had some
That's
Bulgarian grocery store. Did you enjoy here in northeastern, Pennsylvania in the Poconos and you found it palatable
No, it was pretty it was pretty terrible
I I thought you know, it just certainly did not agree with my palate
I could not drink more than a tiny bit of it at a time
But apparently in the Soviet Union, this was more popular than water because you know where water wasn't
Readily available or it wasn't
Clean because this drink was fermented it killed off a lot of the bacteria in it and people would just drink this rather than
water, I mean you would have the
you know the kvass truck coming around rather than the ice cream truck on a hot day, which is just seemed so bizarre to me because
You've you've got to be you've got to have some sort of fortitude to get this stuff down
Doesn't seem like the kind of stuff was there really a kvass truck was it really a kvass?
That's a thing or are you making that up? No, it was it was a thing
I looked this up. There was a kvass truck that would that would come around
But what's weird is that you know, it's made from I believe it's rye bread and Bob said I'm curious, you know
Did you get that taste that sort of overpowering?
You know most moldy bread taste
Well
To me as I said taste it as a beer that was successful or something like that. So it's
more than that I
Cannot say that I managed to get any bread
It might go well with some other stuff too I can imagine y'all testing it and in one
Mode is a lot different than having it alongside
You know some other things to eat or drink and a meal or something
Yeah, the bottle the bottle I got said that it was made in a monastery somewhere
In Soviet times they prevented them and then in recent years the
Folks at the monastery found the recipe and started doing it again or something like that. Of course. Sure. Sure
What a great story. That's that's that's
innovation though like
bringing something and it's almost like a time capsule that knowledge and
And then sharing it in in the present day
So the other question I have for you about them is where did you find the kvass?
Was it in a normal grocery store?
Was it in a specialty grocery store or did you have to buy this in the park already in your refrigerator?
There's this chain of stores that specializes in the Russian
What's it called Russian groceries such
which is
Chain that's based in Germany as far as I know and in for other
Things that I bought from there they were
Made in Germany some of them so it's
kind of weird
But this was imported from Russia somewhere
Basically, there's a chain of store called the birch in Russian that is
Spread around Europe based in Germany or something like that. So, yeah
What was the hue of the of the kvass that you have was it was it like a very dark brown was it a light
Brown Alex, I gotta ask why are you so fascinated with this?
You've really been interrogating him like like some kind of witness at a trial. That's
It's kvass, I mean the fact that the both of you had it that's miracle enough for me, but okay fine
What what color tell us everything about it Bobson the color the color of the one?
I got was dark brown like a stout type brown or maybe darker
There they had a bottle of something
Much paler than that, which I decided to not to go for
Yeah, I think that was a smart yeah, and when you poured it out did did the did the drink have a head on it
You know like a phone
Yes, like
Like a beer
Like a stout wood, I guess
Probably stuff on it
Yeah, it's really I think it's quite interesting and how much carbonation do you think was in it relative
Let's say to coke or Pepsi objection. This has been asked and answered much less your honor
Leading the witness he's leading the witness
Off a cliff. All right withdrawn withdrawn. Oh, yeah. Yeah
You'd better withdraw
It interested that what about what about the price was it was assuming it comes cheaply in Bulgaria even though it's imported calls for
The more expensive than let's say a bottle of coke
Compared to coca-cola, I think it's cheaper. Yes
Interesting
So you think they're trying to cut to coke and Pepsi there and take over the market once again objection calls for speculation
That's good objection there
I'm not sure what coca-cola costs around here because I don't buy this good answer
Is there anything else you'd like to describe about the kvas remember you're under oath
Well, I read about what Belgians call small beer
Which sounds
Reasonably close to it. It seems
But which is a beer of low
low content of alcohol, which is
Around Europe some places and I haven't tried it yet. Oh, it's
That's my impression of it
Well
Gone through the the kvas
Item, I are so many other items in the supermarket
I think that we can we can address on a weekly basis here
Any suggestions for things that I should be on the lookout for that are particularly tasty
in my local Bulgarian market
Well
The thing I want to recommend I don't know if it travels well or if they brew it over there
But it's a bit
It's very easy to get it wrong somehow
it's a
Millet based
Beverage which is called boza
And it's very it's much thicker than the classic
In many ways and it used to be that the beverage that the Ottoman army used to give a
Kilogram of it per day to their
Low-ranking army fit people to and it was enough to feed them and
Keep them hydrated
for a day or so
While they were doing their army
Duties
Nutritional thing
And this is what you would describe this this kind of gruel, I mean, this is what you would recommend rather this
It's good, there's many ways to do it wrong and
A few people nowadays are doing it right that I know of
What should I what should I be asking for again? Remind me of the name?
boza
Boza
Yes, excellent, does that translate to anything in English I
Don't think it does
I
Hope this isn't some kind of
Horrible phrase that I'm gonna be asking for run into your local Bulgarian supermarket and yell boza and see what happens
I will say yeah
Well, excellent. I'm gonna look for this
It sounds like it might be difficult to find but I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna give it my my level best and I promise
To report back fully next week. Oh joy. I look forward to this with bated breath
Gobson Bobson have anything else from you before we sign off for tonight. Yeah 5g landlines, whatever you got. Yeah anything
well, I
Was not awake it's during the radio show so I have to listen up on the
archives because
Okay, so I may not be up to speed to know the themes that you've covered
So what what can I say about landlines they are trying to get rid of them around here for whatever reason but
You don't think about it, you know when they get for those paranoid people out there who may not be so paranoid
If you're just on wireless, they can just turn those off any time
And then all of a sudden nobody can communicate anymore. Think about that there. I just won over all the conspiracy people. Okay, so
We'll save landlines for sure now
Well, I'm using one
At present so I've not I
Have
Keep it for as long as I can
I just think build networks everyone
It's whether whatever type you want to settle on but absolutely
Realize that it's not just a company not not just for others to be building
the networks that you're using
we're all capable of designing and and
Managing our our
Online lives our communication modes. We already do to an extent but I think I'm just so hearing in this
that people are hung have a hunger for
Having more control over this these things and like you're exactly right of any love
I mean every mobile phone is attributed to a specific person with all these sensors and
Ability to
attribute
Your every move your every utterance to this subscriber account
Whereas the older systems you could share you could share a payphone you could share this beige
Telephone on the desk here that used to belong to my grandparents never ratted them out
Never said where they were what they were doing what films they liked anything like that. It just was a phone
This was a phone and a damn good one too. I might add. Yeah, and we're being sort of
lulled and
Falling into the the sort of romance of all these modern features
Anyway Bobson, thanks for calling and have a good night there in in Bulgaria
Merry Christmas if you celebrate it and Happy New Year regardless. Well, we do. Yeah another week before New Year's
Yes
All right, well good hearing from you as always
Sure
Yeah, thanks for staying up and keep listening. Well, we'll look forward to hearing from you next year. Yes
Well next week won't be next year yet. Well, I guess call back next week, too
But that's how it works. Yeah, we don't hear from you. It'll be next year
That's true. Oh
All right, good night and promise anything but yeah
Well, I try and keep in touch
We'll look forward to it. Okay, great to hear you
Do you see during that call we were getting other calls from the operator? Yes a call from zero. Yes zero one digit
Probably rebel somebody figured out how to do it. Okay, funny very funny, but we're not gonna pick that up
I'm not picking up any more phone calls. We're done. Oh, we are. Yeah, it's it's we've been on our in 12 minutes
Okay on overtime. I'll just disconnect this like that
And we're gonna disconnect everything in just a second
let's say our final good nights and invite people to write to us OTH at 2600 comm and
To enjoy this this time of year
Even if you don't have any snow on the ground, which I think we should have call some people they might be lonely
That's true. Yeah, it's a rough time of year for people, you know, so doesn't cost much doesn't cost anything in many many instances
Indeed take care of yourselves. All right. Yeah, happy holidays. Merry Christmas everybody. Good night. Happy Kwanzaa