And as we close today's newscast, we here at Free Speech Radio News send our deepest
condolences to the KPFA staff and the family of morning news anchor and FSRN contributor
Chris Bruni, who died suddenly of a heart attack yesterday.
We thank Chris Bruni for his contribution to Progressive News, to the Pacifica Network
and to Free Speech Radio News.
This is Free Speech Radio News, I'm Deepa Fernandes.
For the WBAI staff, volunteers and of course you, the listeners, to come to this year's
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There will be live entertainment, dance music provided by DJ Tony Ryan, delicious food and
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That's Saturday, July 12th from 3pm to midnight.
Tickets are only $15.
For additional information, you can call area code 212-209-2869.
That's 212-209-2869.
See you at the Pier.
Happy days are here again.
The time is right.
Okay, it's 6.59.
We're going to steal an extra minute here.
It's time for Off The Hook.
The telephone keeps ringing.
So I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving.
Now I can't make a call.
We couldn't get much worse.
But if they could, they would.
Bum-diddly-bum for the best.
Expect the worst.
I hope that's understood.
Bum-diddly-bum.
Ha!
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And a very good evening to everybody.
The program is Off The Hook.
Bernie, are you with us?
I'm here in Philadelphia.
Oh.
Good, okay, I had to hang up because your phone was ringing like 20 times.
And I couldn't wait so I just put you on hold.
Yeah, it rang once on my end but that's SPRINT PCS for you.
Yeah, well, that's SPRINT PCS for you.
Yeah, we stole a minute and the reason we stole a minute is because well, I've got some
unfortunate news yet again that's right we're preempted once more next week this
time for a special on the Philippines and Korea yeah I know it's fascinating
to all the people listening to off the hook but that's just the way they do
things around here and there's nothing I can do about it but you're certainly
encouraged to voice your opinions it's it's it's really frustrating and I don't
want to go off topic for too long here but it's really frustrating trying to do
radio here and every literally at least once a month sometimes twice a month
having to be preempted and and and not covering all the stories that we need to
cover there are so many things that we have to focus on in this time of
tribulation and trouble in our in our nation in our world high technology is
being used against people in all kinds of different ways and it's just something
that I wish we could devote more time to we could devote you know ten times as
much time as we do per week and not run out of material and unfortunately it
seems everything that comes along down the road we're the first choice to be
preempted and once again next week we won't be on so we'll be on in two weeks
unless there's something else going on in the city that needs to be covered
instead of us sorry if I sound upset I'm just upset you know so it's it's
annoying especially considering all the all the hard work people around here do
to keep this place online and keep keep things going keep the station heard by
people all over the place so well actually I should I should say one of
three things is going to happen now okay number one we won't be on next week
number two I'll get a phone calls like you know ten hours before the show next
week saying that they changed their mind and I will be on and of course I won't
be able to tell anybody that because we won't be on the air or number three
neither of us will be on the air the show that we get preempted for it won't
be on either and they'll just be confusion that's happened more than once
anyway that out of the way I just figured I'd let people know so that if I
sound a little perturbed that's that's that's that's the reason what's with
this anti-confusion stance all of a sudden well you know it's I'm all for
confusion I'm just you know let's get our confusion out there as well because
there's a there's a lot of a lot of things that need to be talked about and
and tonight we're gonna have to like try to squeeze a lot of things in Bernie
let's start with you you've got some an update on the sprint PCS situation right
well besides it taking 20 rings for me to hear one ring that's normal for
PCS there's some good news and bad news with sprint as is usually the case but
for our listeners in the show me state Missouri the Attorney General there Jay
Nixon finally reaching agreements with both Nextel and sprint he sued them the
reason Attorney General Missouri sued them is because of what we talked about
last week which these sprint and other carriers apparently being very deceptive
and misleading and how they're charging customers for what they're referring to
is USA regulatory obligations and fees that's what it says in my bill on
Nextel be on Nextel bills it says federal programs cost recovery and and
all these things are is their federal mandates to to do certain things with
their network like provide e911 emergency location I hate to rush you
but we're so pressed for time bottom line is that now in the state of
Missouri and hopefully other states soon sprint's gonna have to be more honest
about them charging these fees these are not taxes and they're representing them
as being taxes and in tariffs and that sort of thing and they're not on this
we're talking about several bucks a month or charging customers so I'm
hoping other state attorney generals get on the bad wagon and sue sprint PCS and
Nextel and get any more honest about how they're billing because you're you're
really paying several dollars more per month than then they're saying and
they're advertising now what sprint's doing now is they announced on Monday
they're gonna be charging an additional dollar fifty a month for e911 and on
top of that another dollar ten a month for this number portability and number
pooling actually let me let me just correct you on that according to the
the thing I'm looking at it's a fee of a dollar fifty forty cents to pay for
e911 a dollar ten to pay for portability thank you okay so another buck fifty a month on
top of the fees you're paying now for these for what sprint should should
really be eating or passing on to customers as part of their monthly
monthly charges now sprint wants to raise their rates that's fine but don't
don't keep your rates the same and add on these other things saying these are
these are like taxes how does this differ from what AT&T and Nextel are
doing it they charge a dollar seventy five and dollar fifty five for both
number portability and 9-1-1 and number pooling are they as guilty as sprint in
this and in some ways I mean they're the numbers are slightly different but but
they're right I don't know what AT&T is doing I haven't seen where their bills
but Nextel was was also named in this lawsuit and decided they were going to
start charging people more honestly as far as what they're doing but um this is
this is a lot of money you might not seem like a couple bucks a month adds up
but like I mentioned last week show just for the it's a federal number pooling
thing so you can transport your number around sprint sprint been charging
everybody 47 cents per number per month for this and with 18 million
subscribers which they have that's over a hundred million dollars a year and
they even haven't they haven't even implemented it yet so this is big bucks
they're scamming the it's more annoying because you know you can't even make a
phone call and and have it work properly yeah it sure does by the way do
you guys know who the nation's number one wireless phone company is anyone I
guess it's not is it T-Mobile yet no it's not T-Mobile we gotta do this fast
because we don't have much time okay Jeff what do you want to guess Verizon
you're right Jeff gets it Verizon is the number one domestic wireless
telephone company and they recently reversed their stance and charging
customers to keep phone numbers they say they will not initially charge fees to
customers and will review in November how to recoup costs which it estimates
at about 10 to 15 cents per customer per month so I had an edge though you had an
edge I had an address before I did no no I'm staying at a hotel Midtown and
there's a couple of Verizon guys staying in a hotel Midtown you live in New
Jersey yeah well I'm at a conference you had a conference right now I don't
know that right now I did not know that you look totally normal he didn't look
like you're in conference mode at all but they're staying there and I had the
opportunity to talk with them and if what was interesting through the
conversation is that the guy told me he doesn't use Verizon for his cell phone
service he uses AT&T that's an interesting revelation speaking of
conferences we're gonna be going to conference mode in just a little bit
we're gonna be talking to some people over in Germany about the upcoming
KRS communications camp so they'll be joining us in just a couple of moments
first a couple of quick updates last week we were talking about the do not
call that gov registry if you recall we demonstrated some interesting things so
Jeff did you ever get that yeah I got the two two responses and what did they
say that nothing had changed nothing had changed what what did we try doing we
tried deregistering your phone right and you said it didn't work it did not work
well we didn't use I didn't use the proper emails either but did the mail
say it didn't work what did the mail say oh no actually we verified it and
everything stayed the same okay well I was able to to get people canceled from
the service just by entering entering their phone number and and their email
not their email my email you know any email worked and the thing is though the
day after that show this is service change yeah the server later you can no
longer cancel the service from on the internet if you go to do not call gov
you will see that that option is no longer there so it's just goes to show
people listen to this program and things that we discover do get acted upon so I
guess that's a good thing but there's still a lot more that needs to be proven
with this system we're talking about the the list of phone numbers that the
government is collecting from people who don't want to be bothered by
telemarketers you simply go to do not call gov or you call a special number
which I don't have in front of me which is now starting to work you have to call
they've made it work this week yes you have to call from the number that you
want to to have on that list I tried calling I tried you know registering a
different number and it did not work I tried registering a number I was calling
from and it did work but they didn't tell you what the number was which is
actually kind of smart because otherwise people are gonna be calling this thing
to find out what their phone number is and you know I guess they don't want to
pay for all those calls but there are still some security issues that are very
much of concern to me namely the fact that this is generating a huge list of
people who value privacy and that list is being given to guess who telemarketers
they have to download the list this is starting in September so we don't know
how it's gonna work they have to download the list from someplace and and
add it to their database so that you they don't do not call you if you are on
that list what happens if that list gets out what happens if the wrong person
gets a hold of it you know it's all kinds of all kinds of concerns there I'm
always wary of adding my phone number to something or any phone number to
something I've already added quite a few phone numbers that don't belong to me
and you can still do that on the internet you can still add any phone
number that you want to this list and and give an email address as long as
you know it'll work I mean not only is this list a list of phone numbers who
people who value their privacy but the list is also linked to all these people's
email addresses or at least the ones who register online for it so that
combination of linked information in the hands of the wrong people is even more
dangerous I think yeah well it is and I'm gonna try something right now live
on the air which I hope is not a felony but I have to try it in the interest of
science and since I have this computer terminal here we're just obligated to
get into trouble I'm going to do not call that gov now the government does
claim that they will not release your email address to anybody yeah they say
they don't store it in the same place I feel better yeah well I mean I'm not
concerned about the email address but here's the thing here's the thing that
I'm concerned about though if if somebody registers my number let's say I
want to hear from telemarketers let's say that's the only calls I get is
telemarketers and I live for that all right some wiseacre out there decides
that I'm not gonna have that pleasure anymore and they add my number to the do
not call list on the internet okay and they use an email address to verify that
they use their email address well I get wind of this I find out about it and I
want to get my number put off that list I want to get the telemarketing calls
again how do I do it I can't do it online I can't I can't delete the you
know the the phone number online anymore and I have to call in or or send an
email I'm having trouble being convinced that this is a serious problem I'm just
saying if you if you if you add somebody to the list they may have a
hard time getting off the list that's all I'm saying look at it as a public
service all right so that's that's that's the issue as far as that goes
this person wrote in very concerned about something they discovered which
actually isn't that new concerning Google they entered their phone number
into Google and they found that there was all of a sudden a roadmap to their
house yeah roadmap to their house was right there and and this will happen if
if you have if you enter a phone number Google will look in all different
databases my friend tested it out this person writes and sure enough the map
led led her to her house privacy as public info anyone who can get your
phone number now we'll be able to get to your house so I tried it and it led me
to someone else's house well you're strange but apart from that here's here's
a little caveat it has to be if the phone back it has to be a listed phone
number and so if it's a listed phone number it's already the information is
already there all you have to do is go to switchboard.com or you know or
Verizon.com even has has reverse directories you enter the phone number
it'll tell you who it belongs to the address and you can plug that into
MapQuest and you know add a step to the whole process but that information is
always there now now find something that has unlisted phone numbers and gives you
the address of those then you know we'll have something really interesting
because your numbers unlisted doesn't mean that a lot of companies don't
already have it as soon as soon as you call an 800 toll-free number and 800
888-866 number whoever you call is likely going to get your number through
something called ANI and you know that's going to be added to a database and
shared with other companies that who is that who is it the investigator we had
at H2K2 Emanuel that Steve Rambam
yeah yeah Steve Rambam he's got a great detail about he says anytime you call a
company toll-free number they will they will generally log your number and link
it in their database and share that with other companies so what I have done
lately with my cell phone my Sprint PCS phone when I call one of those numbers I
have a prepaid calling card it's like three cents a minute so what and I call
toll-free numbers with that card which then prevents the called party from
getting my my Sprint PCS cell phone number which I don't want to give out
right so it just adds an extra layer of security yeah it cost me three cents a
minute to do that but I don't call out of those numbers but when I do I don't
like giving up my my mobile phone number to the people I don't want to have uh-huh
so I'm debating what what to do here let's see you know what I'm gonna do
okay so I'm gonna do I'm gonna I went to the New York Times okay because I know
their phone number and I don't want them to get to get telemarketing calls so I
have just registered them I'm putting in my email address right now and I am
issuing a challenge to anybody out there I'm submitting it now registering okay
and did it work yes I've submitted the phone number for registration in the
national do not call registry you will receive an email to complete your
registration you must open the email and click on the link provided okay here's
the thing I'm not gonna have a chance to do that obviously until I get to a place
where I can check my email when I do that let's say 24 hours from now just
just to be safe I'm gonna click on that and at that point the New York Times
will not be able to get any any telemarketing calls all right the
challenge the challenge that I that I'm going to issue is for anyone out there
to deregister them from this list and see if they can prevent them from being
on the do not call registry all right and that's that's the that's the
challenge I'm issuing all right so they differentiate between residential and
business phone numbers um they do not I don't think also they might they might I
think when I called the number when I called the do not call number it said
residential numbers so I'm not sure if this experiment will necessarily work
all right number well I'm not gonna give them you know the the editors home
number that wouldn't be fair would it why not they need they need some help
anyway there's no I'll tell you what let's get Donald Rumsfeld's home number
we'll enter that because he doesn't need telemarketers calling him it's the
last thing he needs he's gonna have to answer a lot of questions weeks ahead
did anybody catch the Parliament today in England oh my god Tony Blair is
really under fire I mean they're basically yelling at him saying no one's
gonna believe anything you say from now on I can hardly wait till you know we
give Bush that kind of treatment okay we got it we gotta move quickly here people
people are people are meeting outside in the hall it's getting kind of loud
people chastised us for not remembering last week especially since we were we
were on what was it let them continue to yell it's good background noise besides
you might get hurt we forgot to mention that that July 4th was Reagan death
watch day as you recall do you know about this Jeff yeah okay every year we
tell people that July 4th here very quickly every president elected in a
year ending in zero has either died in office or died on the most significant
date in American history July 4th Reagan was elected in 1980 and obviously he
survived is his term in office I know there's some debate as to you know that
but I think it's true that he did and that means that every July 4th is an
especially you know a tense time because that might be the you know and if it
doesn't happen then then the whole thing you know is finished you know
since the beginning of this nation that's that's that's happened anyway we
forgot last week and we were sorry to everybody was offended by us forgetting
we will remember next year all right and obviously Reagan survived at least I
think he did and you never really know for sure he's gonna know well yeah okay
I know that too okay moving along quickly and then we're gonna make a
phone call to Germany a lot of people wrote in again about the MTV calm thing
and apparently they're getting more and more upset at us because we keep wanting
to know why anytime you mentioned 2600 in MTV calm profiles you get either
kicked off the system or that information gets deleted it's it's it's
really pretty incredible more people wrote in a lot more people wrote in
people have have taken to spelling out 2600 and now that's getting deleted too
so this person writes in saying it would appear that an actual person is
monitoring the post in the forums or their filters are smarter since your
last show the other conclusion I have come to is that MTV calm has gotten wise
to the technique where they change O's to zeros in 2600 or zeroes to O's
actually I tried to change my zeroes to O's in the scoop section and my profile
has remained hidden to MTV calm I attempted this after your July 3rd show
you didn't do a July 3rd show we did a lot July 2nd show I don't know where we
did a July 3rd show and that is why I also think that someone at MTV knows that
MTV calm is being discussed and off the hook well you know it's not a far reach
if do not call that gov listens to us it's a fair bet that MTV calm listens to
us as well so hi guys out there why don't you stop deleting us you know and
maybe we'll actually turn on your channel now and then that's just a lot
more offensive than anything we can say it appears as if someone at MTV has
taken the time to go to this length to keep 2600 off of MTV calm you may want
someone else to verify this what I intend to do next this is great I love
how our listeners like are always one step ahead and always think it's
something new and mischievous to try what I intend to do next is set up a
forwarding URL so that MTV calm users can click on a URL that is not 2600 calm
and they will still end up on 2600 calm we will see how that goes and that's
from m2 Mike thank you so much for for your ideas your thoughts and your
support and what else here this this funny news story from from Yahoo
according to to police a shopper in southern France literally named his own
price you hear about this when he yeah when he visited several supermarkets
near Montpellier according to police the 22 year old suspect fabricated barcode
labels on his home computer and by using them to replace the originals was able
to acquire goods for a fraction of their real prices police said a store
clerk spotted him as he was affixing the homemade labels on boxes containing
garage door motors costing 2,000 euros apiece the young man whose identity was
not given allegedly had repriced the motors at 160 euros and then according
to the police and he used the internet to resell the goods he had obtained and
I don't think they were he was reselling them at much of a savings that must be a
heck of a market for a garage door opener motors yeah really okay now it's
time for us to trying to call Germany now I should warn people we had some
problems and Bernie please forgive the the touchdowns you're gonna hear we were
having some problems with this before so you might get to hear all kind we're
gonna block out the numbers as soon as we get past the obvious German parts
okay and now we're dialing the actual local number which we had problems with
before and pound sign to speed it up then we're gonna be asked for our
special a special code with the with the tone here okay and that's the tone
here's our special code let's see if it goes through to Germany we were getting
all kinds of weird recordings and sounds before we have a backup number that does
work in case this doesn't oh it's working how about that hello is this my
goodness are you on the moon all this echo and reverb is this for those who
don't know the German phone system is always very echoey like this this is is
this Tim is this Frank is this Andy who is this I sound like all three of you
for a second there okay who is this we have a speaker phone here well it's
it's it's it's definitely using its option as being a speaker but we need
you to maybe not echo as much if that's possible I don't know yeah there is a
bit of an are you in a hollow room of some sort yeah okay well maybe you want
to put up some insulation or something and or pick up the phone and maybe pass
it around
talk about a communications problem um okay this is not this is not working out
all that greatly we need to establish perhaps just a regular telephone if
you can tell the other number I gave you that you actually sound good now so
whatever you're doing now keep it up yeah okay I just keep that distance to
the microphone okay that's good yeah it does go right up next to the microphone
that's fine who is this again this is Andy now Andy how you doing I'm all
right yeah we're a little bit in the middle of the night here but okay yeah
you know no matter what we can't seem to solve that problem it's always uh you
always like you know six hours ahead of us but it's 1 a.m. or it's 122 I guess
over there yeah we're all planning on though or most of us are planning on
going to the CCC camp next next month you want to tell us something about it
as far as the the actual date how people can get there things like that yeah let
me answer hello this Tim hi Tim um well the communication camp is going to
happen from the 7th to the 10th of August can you hear me yeah I can hear
you but I hear something else too but never mind this just keep going we'll
see how it works and well it's a four day open air festival everybody is
invited and it takes place close to Berlin and yeah well I don't know what
the shortest path from New York is to Berlin but you just take any kind of
airplane over Frankfurt to Berlin Tegel that TXL is an IATA code yeah you could
do that you could you could fly into Amsterdam and take a train from there
there's all kinds of different ways to go now how far is the actual campsite
from Berlin I believe you can get there by it by Espan or by a shuttle or
something like that yeah we're going to have a shuttle operating bringing people
in like 30 kilometers from the city center so pretty close and what we
should say is maybe what's important that also on the website and the whole
conference part of the camp will be in English so this is pretty much also to
ensure that participants from abroad have no problems communicating with us
and we have a description how to get from Berlin Tegel Airport to the camp
online so that's www.ccc.de slash camp okay what's beeping throw that away so
now I understand I understand that the registration has opened up and people
can actually use a credit card to register for the camp now or a bank
card you can as well bring just big boxes of cash with you of course it's
just that it helps us a little bit to run the organizational stories before
the camp when people pay in advance so it's not necessary but it's helpful for
us uh-huh yeah and I understand as someone
organizes a conference every now and then you do need to have something to
start paying back all the expenses that you've incurred at this point now I went
on the website like last week and there were like six pages of numbers I was
supposed to give to my bank and I can I just know that's changed that was last
week when they only had the bank transfer information now you can go
through what is it PayPal I don't know are you guys there yeah we're still here
it's just that your line sounds quite funny it seems to be that the satellite
connection here our line now to the moon and back now it is definitely going to
the moon maybe even Mars and back it might be better if we call the the
mobile phone and we might get less echo it's the other number because that's a
normal tone here okay let me let me try that I'll call that number and well
hopefully get through to you okay we're going to disconnect that one and get
another dial tone so the summary is that people who tried to pay last week should
now try again yeah okay so if you had confusion I don't know why people be
confused I was confused yeah well it's I can stay I think they're asking for a
hundred euros right hundred euros yeah but four days including camping is you
know not bad you know this phone system timed out I was still looking for the
number hold on I gotta do this again dialing an international number is
something that is almost beyond our capabilities here okay now we go into
the secret part and people have no idea how difficult it is to dial this phone
number while talking on the air and the pound sign now we wait for the special
code that we have to enter okay and hopefully this this will sound much
better hopefully it'll go through in the first place and Bernie are you still
there just out of curiosity okay good good it's amazing we haven't lost you
okay as we wait for Germany to connect I don't like the sound of that what it
what kind of noise is that yeah that's not a German ring something weird
happened here we're sorry your call did not go through will you please hang up
and try your call again this is a recording we're sorry I don't know what
voice yeah please hang up all right we're gonna hang up and try speaking in
German you know what we're going through here is so much easier than what you'll
go through if you just show up at the camp because you know there's no
communication problems over there everybody speaks English they don't
speak in echo and and you're you're able to to make your connections rather
easily especially if you go by train and in Europe it's no problems at all okay
all right now we're waiting for the special tone there's a special tone we
enter the special code and hopefully we'll get a special ring unbelievable
and you know I'm gonna be over there too people gonna figure out a way to call me
when I'm when I'm there and we know how much fun that can be oh it's a new
recording it is not necessary to dial zero after the country code when dialing
this country I didn't please hang up and try your call again but I didn't do that
I didn't do that it's certainly special how dare you accuse me of something I
did not do I did not dial zero I dialed three zero you probably didn't hear the
three mm-hmm well you know this 1960s technology if that have to verify all
these numbers get hit you heard the three that was a three okay that's the
zero and now we dial the number maybe this is why we keep getting preempted
because we can't master making a phone call all right now we're waiting for the
tone not that tone that's the tone saying that we're finished dialing this
is the tone okay we enter the secret code instead this is the last time I'm
gonna try this number if this doesn't work I'm gonna try their their mobile
number let's see what happens oh that's a German ring okay yes we had so much
trouble if you and if you listening I know we hear the audience frame so I
give you to Tim okay all right it sounds much better doesn't it okay all
right Tim you sound great this is really a perfect connection is that yes let's
never lose this connection okay where did we stop well we were talking about
registration and how to register for people that that are safe from the
United States and want to go to this thing they can now use PayPal I believe
is that right yeah they can if they really like to pay in advance which is
helping us a lot anyway this registration is just more for getting
your personal nickname at the camp which is then well your your basic nickname
for other services we are planning to to have running on the camp and what can
people do with this nickname once they're once they're on site well we
hope to have like an email account a Java account in a web blog running under
the same nickname so it's just like having your nickname handy at the camp
makes it easy for other people to get in contact with you if everything is
running okay what's the setup going to be like it's a campground and when we by
the way when we say a hundred euros that includes you know staying there for four
days obviously so if it sounds like a lot to keep in mind that you're not
going to be spending money on a hotel yeah that's true it's like we are
putting out the whole infrastructure so there's power it's like 60,000 square
meters it's a huge area there's a lovely lake there's big tents we've got
two main tents with lectures in it many other tents where activity is going on
several workshops and of course many people are going to gather putting up
their tents as well forming a huge camp so we are taking care of the
infrastructure and organizing the content in advance and everything else
how big a space are we talking about here
meters like 300 meters times 300 meters something like this Wow that's three
football fields by three football is this the same location you guys had a
few years ago yeah it's exactly the same location we were four years ago
how many people showed up to that one it was around 1,500 and we expect a bit
more this time hopefully okay what was some of the highlights of the last camp
for those people considering going the highlight of the last camp well I think
most of the people really had a lot of fun in these three days and we had some
interesting lectures going on of course and I think it was mainly the the
atmosphere people were touched by because it was really looking like well
actually we were repairing the spaceship you probably know that which
was yes and was coming to planet earth and all this usual stuff people are
usually not believing this but it is true and that was what's going on and if
you look on the website ccc that www.ccc.de slash camp there's an archive
of the last camp yeah there's an archive there's a photo gallery so people can
have a look what it looked like actually frightened pretty pretty nice pretty
nice pictures and yeah that's what you will find there how many many Americans
showed up last time significant number or very few how many American I'm aware
of at least 20 okay 20 to 30 something like this could have been more but it
was already more than we expected well I you know I would hope that a lot more
would show up this time only because the atmosphere is just so incredibly
different over there if the if the the conferences like how are any indication
it's just like night and day going to a conference in Europe and going to one
here in this country and of course the chaos Congress's that take place every
December they're also very relaxed informative meet a lot of interesting
people and I wish more Americans would go because I think they'd learn a lot
and they'd come back feeling refreshed and and invigorated inspired that kind
of thing so I'm hoping that the fact that you guys have made it easy to
register now you will will convince a lot of people to go actually quite quite
a lot of Americans have already signed up so I have every reason to believe
there are many many many more coming than four years ago I mean when we
started four years ago nobody really knew what we were about to do and we
didn't really have the credibility of doing such a huge organization for this
and I think I hope anything special plan that was not done four years ago oh I
mean there's these little details that didn't work out in the end I mean there
were many many smaller things but in the end we were pretty happy it didn't
really work out financially for us but by the actual result of what was going
on and how the event was accepted by the people who are pretty happy with it but
you Frank can give you an overview it were planning from yeah okay that'd be
good this time for the content okay basically there will be free content
tracks or two depending on how much submissions we get we have a pretty
busy schedule trying to figure out what kind of use and topics are going to be
relevant in the next time there will be a lot of talk about of course about a
TCPA and associated stuff that means the means of the content industry to getting
control over our heart and what they can do against it we have a pretty busy
biometrics check where people are talking about what if it will have
biometrics on a society and how to circumvent biometrics for violence we
have of course a lot of let's say normal hardcore and I got topics like
colonel stuff security stuff and so on but we always try to keep the focus a
little bit wider and include topics that are not mainstream at the moment but
that we feel that will be interesting in the next time now you mentioned that
depending on how many submissions you get does that mean you're still
accepting submissions and it's true yeah there is the address content at camp dot
ccc.de and we still accepting submissions probably until two days
before the camp slots are getting filled up but there are still slots available
okay now for people that that might not be into the whole camping scene do they
have any options are there places they can go that are nearby or a way to get
there I didn't get the last well what options are you talking about if people
don't want to camp out is there anything else they can do can they take a you
know if they really don't want to camp which I guess they really want when they
are there I'm sure they don't want to leave but there is when totally in the
desert there's a small town nearby so there are hotel options for where
anybody who wants that isn't there a shuttle or something that goes to to a
subway well in the end of the camp and we're trying to be a bit outside now
there's no subway in in in reach but if you want to get back to Berlin it's not
very problematic we're still pretty close of the city although it doesn't
really look as if we were closed we are pretty close and there's well we have a
shuttle bus and it's going to be operated bringing you well to the next
connection to the city center so whenever you feel the urge to breathe in
the city you have the chance to do that some of us live in Manhattan and just
can't take too much clean air yeah we need that you know that that carbon
monoxide you know okay we're going to take care of this we do everything for
you great well now is there is there anything that you'd like to express to
you know an American audience or an audience you know throughout the world
as maybe just to make sure that more people show up and make this better than
then than previous conferences like what can we do to help well come I mean
basically coming is the best contribution you can do we are still
interested in new interesting topics when it comes to lectures talks that
really would like to see especially things that are probably well building
new bridges understanding what's going on at your place which is sometimes
good you know and well I mean do you have any idea some extra comments I hand
you over okay and it's also a great chance to visit old Europe hey old
Europe so much about it yeah I noticed you've even put old Europe in in the
address in parentheses and I mean we still elect our government here it's not
like the United States where does that such a system actually work where the
people elect the the government sounds kind of dangerous sounds very dangerous
yes I mean that let's say like this the level of stimulation of democracy is
still let's say it's a little bit more convincing here in some parameters and
there's other parameters where it's just same but I guess there are these small
little differences and it's I guess it's a real interesting time for Americans to
come to old Europe as well as it is for us Europeans to come to the United States
right now and see a country that has changed over the last years as well well
you touched on a very interesting point because a number of people have expressed
this concern to me they think that the whole rest of the world hates us now do
people have to worry when that when it becomes known that they are Americans
walking around in Europe no definitely not at the camp because I mean it's
really an intergalactic meeting of people and we don't judge you by the
government because we know that you didn't deserve your government I mean
it's just happened to you because let's say other reasons and I I guess you
don't really have to worry here in Berlin because in Berlin also many
American people live and it's really a multicultural city it's just the way
that of course let's say in in some suburban areas if you really want to
convince people that it was a good idea for the United States government to you
know go to Iraq and and all that kind of bullshit yeah you might get into
trouble but I don't think that that's the kind of people who want to come to
our camp right I don't think so but you know there's nothing wrong with a good
debate now and then but I'm not sure if that's really yeah but but I mean I mean
European people are pretty open and I mean we have a culture of debate here
and of discussion of it so don't be afraid of anyone hitting you that will
not be no no it's like the debate is something I think we should try here now
and then it would be nice yeah right we didn't we didn't really experience that
on our last trip to Berlin well we weren't preaching like Bush doctrine
either and also I mean if anyone wants to wants to stay here in Europe maybe we
could even help you obtain a visa or you know we we also thought about an
immigration workshop because some Americans ask us if it would be
possible to you know move over here because it seemed a little bit more
relaxed I mean maybe it's a good chance to find out what's different here and if
it's a good place and we we might even help you to immigrate or whatever yeah
well you know I'm gonna be over there for for over a month not not just in
Germany but traveling around through Russia and Belarus and places like that
so it's it's it's really gonna be you can attach this to something much bigger
if you want to and I advise people to do that it'll keep you sane or at least you
know it'll make you think you're sane a couple of questions from the people in
the studio then we're gonna take some phone calls to one two two zero nine two
nine hundred Leo you first oh yeah what's the like how would you get food
at the camp like food or water and water oh we have we will have some food how
you called lots of food so food stamps it's not the problem we have many there
a water and everything is there so you can either cook your own food or you can
just buy food and we have pizza there we have vegetarian food there we have
all kinds of food there so that won't be any kind of problem of course internet
connectivity will be all over the place including in the sea so you can have
underwater internet if your equipment does it oh I have to see that I like how
people put internet access on the same plane as food and water but for some
people it is the same absolutely as I go to that redhack you've got something
what I was just curious how many different countries or people from
different countries will be represented at the camp difficult question I mean in
European countries the situation is different the Italians seem to get more
organized as Spanish Bulgarian people are there we have a larger group of
Austrians coming over the place Switzerland is there so it's kind of all
European countries have sent their kind of a group there some of the groups are
more let's say computer artists in their own definition some are more political
others are more hardcore technical people so it's quite different the
hackers seen in Europe how the local groups and the different countries make
their turn do you get many people from say Poland Lithuania Latvia Estonia
Russia or Belarus because I'm going there and I don't know anybody from any
of those countries yeah to be honest the eastern part of Europe is developing
right now so you have to acknowledge that their internet connection and and
they're the kind of network connectivity over the last years has been simply not
here not not there and start to exist over the last few years only so that
doesn't mean they're behind it doesn't mean just they they are different in
their technical approach sometimes and the first context are established to
people over there and we know that that the camp is well known there and what we
do so it's gonna be a surprise for us as well how many from that kind of
countries will appear actually yeah it's really you know if you've ever been to a
conference this is something it's more like you know meeting people for the
first time from different cultures different lands people who are just
getting into the whole internet world right now so it's a lot more you know
the feeling of discovery is there because you actually are experiencing
something new yeah yeah you're seeing some old friends too but it's it's more
like you're seeing new things as well and I think we lose that in the States
a lot because we tend to see the same people you know time after time and not
enough new people and that's that's very important and also what's very important
to say about the Eastern bloc they have interesting situations there for example
some countries are not so much technically behind that but they have
not really heard about copyright law so that's kind of interesting what those
people bring when coming to a conference mm-hmm yeah yeah I'd like to see that
perspective there yeah all right take some phone calls to one two two zero nine
two nine hundred let's let's go up here we're with the folks over at chaos in
Germany talking about the chaos camp which takes place August 7th 8th 9th and
10th oh and by the way people are welcome to come early right and help set
up yeah of course okay and how can they get more information on that just in on
the website it on the website I mean we've got basic information on the main
website and there's a link to our wiki system which provides even more in-depth
information and isn't chance for everybody who's doing some kind of
project to well document what he's about to do or just well look for information
of other projects happening so yeah that wiki system is really cool I was playing
with it and it's really a lot of fun mm-hmm so let's take a phone call to one
two two zero nine two nine hundred and good evening you're on the air good
evening how you doing I'm an American who has done some camping in Berlin many
years ago and I can wholeheartedly recommend especially in the month of
August that people go there for the weather etc I am missing something here
what areas of subject matter will be covered at this camping convention guys
what we're trying to cover the the classic hacker lineup of topics like
which are like an electric and in the electronic era subjects that related to
the electronic era well computer hacking computers internet that okay yeah all
right I didn't get that I got that is quite an extraordinary city certainly
is yes bye-bye all right thanks for calling Berlin is an amazing city
especially if you like New York I think Berlin is something that a lot of people
will feel you know something for as soon as they as soon as they arrive sorry the
website yeah the website is www.ccc.de and we're talking about the chaos
communications camp yeah I put a slash camp at the end of that too if you want
to go directly to the to the camp for it all right let's take another phone call
and good evening you're on no you lost that one good evening you're on the air
yeah I wish I could afford to go to another country but you know it's good
that you can't actually let's go to over here good evening you're on the air well
it's better than the last one good evening you're on the air yes Bernie yes
I've used my MCI calling card and MCI standalone calling card and with both
cards the number would show up on people's caller ID even though I'm
calling MCI's 800 number oh well if you buy a prepaid calling card you may not
have that problem it did not pass my number okay prepaid is different thank
you sir thanks for your call let's go over here and good evening you're on the
air all right let's go over here good evening you're on the air hi how you
doing okay I'm calling because earlier on did you mention that it had a block
your number from being seen do you know how to do that oh that you just dial
star six seven or you ask your your phone company to put you on block okay
what I really want to talk about is that Verizon whom I a customer of list
your telephone number if it's you know published allowed to be published
otherwise it doesn't get listed however when you dial directory assistance for
anywhere whether it's in the United States or local and they're not Verizon
customers they don't list their names of these people so then I have to do
another kind of dialing because MCI and Sprint and any other primary carriers
will not tell their customers that they can have their telephone numbers listed
with Verizon directory assistance did you know that no I did not yes and I
found out through the supervisor because I said listen I just got the
number by dialing the area code 1-800 then the area code and I got you know a
555 blah blah and I said I got it and how come you don't have it and she tell
me if they do not list if they are not Verizon customers and Sprint and MCI or
other primary carriers do not tell their customers because the primary carriers
would it would cost them to list their customers with Verizon's directory
assistance okay so it's a not equal treatment for people at different
companies absolutely all right thanks for the info sure bye and as you can
tell we've been talking about a lot of different subjects trying to cram
everything in so that's why we're getting some calls that aren't
necessarily related to the CCC camp that's but if you do have questions
about the CCC camp or just something that you'd like to talk to our guests
about who are Tim Frank and Andy from the chaos communications club over there
in Berlin please give us a call two one two two zero nine two nine hundred
rolling on for a couple more minutes and we're not on next week so please make
those phone calls now Bernie do you have any questions or comments I just want to
make a comment having gone to the CCC Congress last year and how the year
before that it's really a just a breathtaking and mind expanding
experience to go to old Europe as Bush would call it or actually that was
Rumsfeld wasn't it it just seems such more of an open society and it's less
fear and paranoia and more of an open exchange of ideas I found and you know
there's a way that you can use that in a very positive sense a lot of people say
oh you're just spouting anti-american rhetoric but you know you you go
somewhere you see how people do things you like the way they do things and you
bring that home and you you figure out a way you figure out a way to make it
work here hey speak for yourself I'm spouting anti-american rhetoric well go
ahead and spout and but you know you don't have to it's not mandatory and the
great thing about Europe is the fact that you know different countries and
all these different cultures are as far away as for us different states so
really you've got all these different cultures in one place and they can all
get together in right outside Berlin and meet yeah and it's you know imagine if
every state in the Union spoke a completely different language and yet
somehow we were all able to like get along and understand each other so that's
that's pretty important let's try to take some more phone calls good evening
you're on the air okay we don't want that phone call and let's try this one
here good evening you're on the air yes I'd like please stop calling us good
evening you're on the air go ahead I mean you know this is Lynn I was up
there a few weeks ago just wanted to say hi and wish that I could go to the the
chaos conference but I wanted to throw in one thing AT&T also does a similar
similar type of thing but with with their prepaid card but I had sent you an
email about the the next tell and Verizon push to talk thing I didn't know
if you wanted to get into that or not probably not tonight only because we're
trying to focus on the on the chaos camp Lynn from the Atlanta free net project
yeah oh yeah great to have you back yeah and by the way I'm coming in over
Vonage show so well really how is that just like it that's uh it sounds like a
normal phone connection well yeah that's it it works pretty good uh-huh that of
course is the system where what's it what's it known for mostly it's a it's a
SIP based voice over IP using a Cisco ATA adapter mm-hmm and it works it works
very well actually it has some interesting things number one is your A
and I is definitely manipulated it does not give the proper A and I information
to whoever you're calling well you can get phone number for say California in
New York City right that's the other thing well actually and also you can
have a virtual telephone number for multiple virtual telephone numbers so I
actually have one for Atlanta even though I'm not in Atlanta and one for my
local area and every one of those you want to add is five dollars now your
outbound caller ID if you choose not to suppress it will be whatever your
primary number is but there's also a new company but I don't know too much about
it's offering it for ten bucks less a month mm-hmm which is called packet eight
yeah CK whatever eight the number eight I'd like to talk about this a lot
further but but anyway let's let's do it in a couple of weeks so we can focus
more on the on the chaos thing right now yeah and I wish I certainly wish I could
make it over there it sounds like it would be a great a great conference to
make yeah miss a good time yeah well yeah I am gonna miss a good time do
whatever you can do whatever you can to to get over there okay I'll give you
guys a call another time yeah maybe in your neck of the woods next week I'll
give you a call okay thanks for calling let's let's try and get a couple more
calls in here hopefully some questions for the guys online let's go over here
good evening you're on the air man what's going on here good evening you're
on the air Wow three in a row okay good evening you're on the air
yes Bernie a question for you you know what do we have to get a court order
against this guy good evening you're on the air go ahead yes go ahead where you
coming from oh sorry yeah I'm on the Long Island Expressway oh good well be
careful thank you I was curious at the camp is is there anything on the agenda
related to penetrating wireless networks or quantum encryption what kind of
quantum sorry quantum encryption that's what you
added there will be in will be in a topic cluster with about three or four
lectures depending on what we get focusing on quantum encryption and
quantum computers for decryption matters we're trying to actually get one of the
groups that is doing free space laser quantum encryption stuff to set up one
of their experiments on the camp but that's the answer at the moment Wow does
that answer your question yes it does okay all right drive carefully and
that's that's all the time we have for phone calls guys as far as as far as the
the registration information goes CCC www.ccc.de slash what registration
server where everything you need is on that website so this is just the easiest
okay so you can register directly through there again the camp takes place
August 7th 8th 9th and 10th near Berlin it's it's well worth going to any more
information can be found on that website we can be emailed OTH at 2600.com as
mentioned earlier we are unfortunately going to be preempted next week we
should be back again in another week after that and hopefully won't be
preempted the week after that we'll see we'll see
the AI is always in flux you know so until then the manual goldstein for
everybody else have yourselves a good night and stay tuned for the personal
computer show good night
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