And this is radio station WBAI in New York, where the time is 10 o'clock.
Time once again for Off The Hook.
Time once again for Off The Hook.
And a very good evening to one and all, this is Off The Hook, the weekly program dealing
with telecommunications and computers and the advances and regressions that we face
every day in our society as a result of those particular things which develop.
Today is a rather monumental occasion, it's the last program that Fiber-Optic will be
on before he is sent to prison for a period of a year and a day, which technically could
wind up being as little as 10 months, but that's about as little as we can hope for.
Fiber-Optic is a voice that many of you have heard over the past couple of years on this
program, answering all kinds of questions and things like that, giving information,
giving his own special brand of expertise to the entire crazy world of technology that we're
plunging headlong into. So this is the last program where Fiber-Optic will be on the air,
and we will be devoting the vast majority of the program to the calls, people calling in,
and we'll do that in just a few minutes. And first, a couple of interesting news items which
are popping up, as news items are prone to do. MCI has announced a rather startling development.
I wouldn't say startling so much, it's just, well, if you worked for a phone company,
maybe you would say startling. Because MCI is planning to enter the local markets.
They're planning to start local service, not just long-distance service. Remember that competition
we were talking about, as far as competition to the local phone companies, New York Telephone,
or 9x as they're called now? You may one day have a choice. Now, that's not going to come
tomorrow, it's not going to come next week, but it might happen in the next couple of years,
and it's not going to happen everywhere. It'll happen in major cities, but this is what the MCI
people are saying at the moment. MCI Communications, which is the company that, according
to the New York Times, probably opened AT&T's monopoly on the long-distance telephone business
more than 20 years ago, has announced a two-billion-dollar plan to invade the local
telephone market. Two billion dollars. MCI also announced a vaguely defined vision
to team up with unspecified partners on a 20-billion-dollar effort to upgrade
its long-distance network for an array of voice, video, and high-speed data communications,
using a vast network of underground conduits that it acquired several years ago from Western Union,
the former telegraph company. Actually, I guess they still are the telegraph company. I'm not
quite sure what Western Union does these days. MCI plans to build local fiber optic networks in
the nation's 20 biggest cities over the next several years. Initially, MCI intends to use
the fibers to link its corporate customers directly to its long-distance network, bypassing
the local bell telephone companies and avoiding the access charges MCI now pays the phone companies
for local connections to corporate customers. Each year, MCI pays local phone companies five
billion dollars in access charges, which account for about half the cost of long-distance phone
calls. They are by far the most lucrative segment of the local telephone market. Over the longer
term, MCI executives outlined a vision of providing local driveways onto a high-speed national network
that offers video on demand and enough speed to transmit an entire library of books across
the country in a few seconds. It also hopes to compete with the bell companies by offering
local access to other long-distance carriers, including its arch-rival, the American Telephone
and Telegraph Company. Imagine that. Imagine the embarrassment, the embarrassment at AT&T
corporate headquarters when MCI walks in the door and says, hey, we can get you into the local market,
which is what they got them out of in the first place. Oh, yeah. Well, AT&T, I'm sure, will be
just tickled pink about that. There's a big double-page ad in today's New York Times as well.
That article, by the way, was from the business section of today's Times, and we only read a
small part of it. There's all kinds of weird things going on. 25 years ago, we took on the
largest company on earth. Today, we take on space and time. You have to wonder what's going on down
at MCI headquarters. They're really laying on the hallucinogenics quite a bit over there.
This time, this is the ad, this time the monopoly is the map and the clock, and MCI has an astonishing
plan of liberation from them. Sounds like one of those press releases from, you know, those
Banana Republic-type countries that, yeah, astonishing plan of liberation from. Today,
we inaugurate the nation's first transcontinental information superhighway, part of an overriding
vision for the next century that bears the name, this is the name, folks, get ready, this is the
name, Network MCI. Now, it's really cool the way they do this, because the word network is in small
letters, and MCI is in capital letters. Network MCI is all one word. Yeah, the road that for this
technology is SONET fiber optic technology, which fiber optic, in fact, is going to tell us what
exactly that is, as soon as I can reach over all these papers and turn your microphone on. What is
SONET, anyway? Actually, it's SONET. I'm sorry, SONET. Well, it's just that the Shakespeare
sonnets have two ends, and so I figured the MCI sonnets that had one end would make it SONET,
but that's just me. Blame Bellcore. All right. SONET is a synchronous optical network, and it's
a new standard for fiber optic communications, and if I remember correctly, I think the speed of it,
don't quote me on this, I think the actual speed of the carrier is 84.48 megabits per second. Well,
I can tell you that the SONET fiber optic technology has the power to move information
15 times faster than any SONET network available today. Does that sound right to you? I don't know.
SONET fiber optic technology has the power to move information 15 times faster than any SONET
network available today. Yes, and coupled with SONET will be ATM switching technology, giving
the network self-healing capabilities within a sub-second. Does it say that? Yes, it does say
self-healing. What is a sub-second, by the way? Does anybody know that? Sub-second? Microseconds,
milliseconds? I've never heard of sub-second before. I think all of those would be considered
sub-seconds, and just for those listening, ATM is not an automated teller machine, but they're
referring to asynchronous transfer mode, which is a method of switching. But speaking of automatic
teller machines, did anybody catch NYPD Blue last night? They had that story that took place in
Connecticut where somebody had a fake ATM. They actually had somebody do this on the show. They
set up a fake ATM, and people had their checking accounts wiped out, and they couldn't pay the rent,
and they couldn't pay the diaper service, and all kinds of things like that. It was really sad,
but you know what bothered me about that? I'm really detracting from what I'm talking about
here, but what really bothered me was that they implied that the bank was not liable for something
like that, you know, for allowing a machine to be set up in the first place with its name on it.
It's a weird situation where you can walk up to a machine, and it can rob you. It can rob you,
take the information off your magnetic strip, and someone can just duplicate a card,
and you're responsible for that. I mean, the bank gives you the card, the bank tells you how to use
the card, and then there is no security for the card, and you have to pay. That's not right.
Anyway, let's get back to the MCI thing, and let's get over this as quickly as we can.
Together, they will shrink the distances between humanity with everything from broadcast quality
video phones, to long-distance medical imaging, to universal access to information, to worldwide
personal communication services. Now, this sounds like nothing so much as the You Will campaign at
MCI, not MCI, AT&T. It's hard to tell the difference these days, but AT&T has had for the
last couple of months. They're having these vast dream-like visions of things that they're going
to invent in the future that don't exist yet, and they've taken the credit for it before they've
even been invented, and it's the most incredible thing. Imagine being able to zip from Mars to
Pluto in a fraction of a second. Well, AT&T is going to do that someday. Yeah, makes you want
to go out and buy stock, doesn't it? Anyway, continuing here, the first traveler on the New
York to LA portion of the superhighway will be the Internet. MCI, in one of telecommunications'
best-kept secrets, and I'd like to know if you know about this, Farber, has been providing
Internet connections for the last half-decade. Have they been providing connections and not
telling anybody? I don't know if it's specifically MCI, but I believe they're part of the little
group of companies, along with Merit and IBM and so on and so forth,
that I believe co-own the NSF Net Backbone. Uh-huh. It is a best-kept secret in their eyes.
Anyway, it now empowers 20 million people to conduct a worldwide conversation with each other
via computers, and what Network MCI will do—notice how that rolls off your tongue,
Network MCI—what Network MCI will do is unite the human voice and data and video image and
interactive multimedia for the entire nation and beyond. Boy, isn't this nice of them? MCI,
together with its partners, will invest more than $20 billion over the next six years to create a
veritable brain trust for the information age. The space-time continuum—yes, the space-time
continuum is being challenged. The notion of communication has changed forever. All the
information in the universe will soon be accessible to everyone at every moment.
Are they really saying—
This is all here in today's New York Times. This is an MCI ad. This is the most incredible ad I've
ever seen. I mean, it's a bit—you have to—yeah, you have to look at this to verify it. They really
say this.
About the universe?
Yeah, every bit of information in the universe will be available to everyone at every moment,
and all because of a dream known as the information superhighway and a vision known as
Network MCI. And a little asterisk at the bottom says, so you'd better not stand in the way, FCC.
Or any other organization that's going to spoil things for everybody.
All right, that took a lot of paper.
And there's all kinds of other things in the papers over the past couple of days,
including tariffs filed by New York Telephone. Do you see these? New York Telephone tariffs?
Now, New York Telephone doesn't exist anymore, so why are they still filing tariffs? That's
what I'd like to know. You know, all kinds of things about reverse information, you know,
CNAs, reverse number information, whatever they call it. Basically a way of calling information,
asking them who belongs to this phone number, and they'll tell you if it's listed.
That's something that phone freaks and hackers have made use of for years. It's been available
for a long time in the calls directory. But now it's going to be available to mere people like us.
So that's something that we can look forward to as well. But what's weird is being offered by
New York Telephone. Now what I'd like to do, I'd like to see, remember last week we did this, we
called up local information, I believe, and we heard for the last time the New York Telephone
recording. Now let's see, let's see if they have, as they said they would on January 1st,
changed everything. I think it's very important that we do some checking up here. Okay,
there's our trusty dial tone, and we're going to call. No, we're not going to call anywhere,
because I guess we didn't pay the touch tone fee, did we? Now, okay, let's try another line.
Hey, no, we didn't pay the touch tone fee on any of our lines, apparently. Let's try this one.
There we go. Let's see what happens.
New York Telephone, what town, please? Oh, I'm sorry, I was trying to reach 9x.
Okay. Okay, so long. Well, apparently, she didn't know either. Okay.
Wow, 9x, what's that? Okay, it doesn't work on information yet. How about that?
Does not work on information. Let's try zero plus calls.
What shall we call? Let's call ourselves.
Whoops. You're supposed to dial 212 first, right, in New York? Yeah. Okay.
I keep forgetting that.
It doesn't really make any sense, but...
Okay, so let's try that again.
Yeah. Okay.
I keep forgetting that.
It doesn't really make any sense, but...
Let's see what happens. New York Telephone. Oh, what's going on here?
I mean, you know, I wrote the check out to 9x. I've been complaining about 9x all week. I haven't
said a single bad thing about New York Telephone since January 1st, because they don't exist
anymore. But what do I see? I see New York Telephone vans, I see New York Telephone
advertisements and tariffs, and I hear New York Telephone on the phone. What's a person to do?
All right, enough of this. Fiber, this is your last show. Yes, it is. At least for the next,
well, how long do we estimate it's going to be that they'll lock you up for?
Roughly 10 months.
No, that's quite a time. That will bring us to October, I believe, of this coming year.
It's been pretty crazy and hectic, I imagine, over the past couple of weeks. You're actually
supposed to report, Wayne, on Friday? Yeah, that's right. In a place called Schoolkill,
Pennsylvania, where you'll be spending time, and hopefully you'll be writing to us here at
the radio station. Yep, I'll certainly... Since you won't be able to be on the air.
I'll certainly try to write, at least. Any thoughts you want to get? By the way,
good article in this week's Village Voice. Yeah, I was really happy to read that. I thank
Julian DeBell for writing it. It was a really nice article. It's the one with Beavis and...
No, it's not Beavis and Butthead, is it? Is that supposed to be Clinton and Bush?
No, it's supposed to be our former and current mayor. Oh, no, actually it's Mayor Koch.
Oh, there's a mayor. I can't tell political cartoons. It's Koch and Giuliani. Koch and Giuliani,
okay, in the form of Beavis and Butthead. Okay, so, yes, pick up the Voice and check out that
article. Nice picture, too. I haven't actually seen it yet. I'm just saying what other people
have said to me. Open the page, why don't you? What page is it on? This newspaper has about
a thousand pages in it, so I don't know what page to go to. 44. 44? I hope you're not just
saying that. Oh, look, there you are. Yes, the bite man of Alcatraz, they call you.
The prisoner. Fiber optic goes directly to jail. Wow. Well, that's something. So,
that's in this week's Village Voice. Our phone lines are open. 212-279-3400. Let's
say goodbye to Fiber in BAI style.
Hello, who are you? Where are you calling from? This is George calling from Berkeley.
George from Berkeley. How are you? Hey, man, I'm pretty good. You're George Gleason, obviously.
Yes, that's the one. You've been on this program before and you've met Fiber a few times. Yep.
Mark, you there? Yep, I'm right here, George. Hi. Did you ever get my email? I think I may have.
Long time ago. Yeah. Anyway, well, I guess this may be the only chance we have to talk before you
before you go away. Yeah. I don't know what to say that I can say when it's on the air, but
just that I'm with you in spirit. And I can't hear the program on the West Coast, obviously,
but if you've got an address or anything like that, you know, if you want to keep up a
correspondence, I'd be glad to. OK, we'll be corresponding on the net, George. So you can
just send an email to me and I'll make sure you get the address. And anyone else out there that's
on the net, you can just send mail to Emanuel at well.sf.ca.us and I'll make sure I forward you
the address. Mark, how are you? You're going on Friday. Is that it? Yeah, basically, I'm going
out with Erica, actually. Emanuel, sorry. How are you? How are you feeling about this whole thing?
Well, I'm very stressed about the whole thing and it's rather hard for me to talk about it,
frankly. You've never been to prison before, obviously. Basically, imagine this. Imagine
somebody coming up to you and say saying, by the way, day after tomorrow, you have to go to prison
for 10 months and you've never been in prison before. So it's kind of hard to imagine what's
what what to feel because you don't know yourself what to feel. Mark, the only thing I can say is
a couple of friends of mine went went away for went to prison for resisting draft registration
and they were in a very similar situation in the sense that it was one of these
minimum security facilities. They were in F.C.I. in Danbury and what they reported was that the
nastiest part of the whole thing was that it was simply boring. And so anything that could keep up
their intellectual interests was a good thing. But that basically that, you know, the minimum
security facilities are they're a drag. I mean, there's no doubt about that, but that it's not
as bad as a lot of it. I mean, who am I to say, because I've never been behind bars myself, but
but that if this is of any reassurance at all, I mean, from friends of mine who've been in the
same situation for a year for the same, you know, at the same level, it's like the worst part about
it is just the simple boredom. And if you can keep your, you know, keep your interest alive and keep
your spirit alive with correspondence and with, you know, things like that, I mean, that that's really
that that doesn't make time pass necessarily a whole lot faster. But it's not like it's not
like being locked up in Maxi or anything like that. George, let me ask you a quick question.
And we got to get on some more phone calls. Would you say that that fiber optic is it's the closest
thing we have to a political prisoner these days in this country? Well, pretty darn close. But I
mean, there's a lot of political prisoners right now. And you've got the people like the activist
for the American Indian Movement, Leonard Peltier, if I'm not mistaken. And yeah, I mean, there's no
doubt about it. We've got political prisoners and that fiber definitely qualifies as one in this in
this day and age. I mean, I think that the public will recognize that in the years down the road
more than they do now. There's a there's a long history of people having to suffer imprisonment
for their beliefs and for the actions which support those beliefs. And if nothing else,
if you can always keep the moral high ground in your heart about it and and also remember that
the love and the friendship of all your folks on the outside and stuff like that, you know. But
yeah, I think that in the years to come, this will be recognized as the time of a witch hunt,
approximately equivalent to McCarthyism, that some of our best and brightest were made to suffer
this kind of persecution for the fact that they that they dared to be creative in a way that
society didn't didn't understand. I don't know what else to say. I mean, you know, this guy,
I mean, you know, all I can say is, is you guys are you guys are doing you guys are doing great
things. And it's it's I don't know, Mark, dude, I wish I could. You know what I'm saying? It's
like it's hard to find words, man, because it really it I feel sad inside that this is happening,
you know, and and the only other thing is, I'll keep you posted about what's happening on the work
on the West Coast here, because I'm sure you'll be getting a lot of opportunities and options
from other people. But I haven't forgotten that original commitment in terms of of anything that
can can be worked out with us out here and stuff like that. And so, okay, George, well, thanks.
Thanks for, you know, for your comments. And thanks for being there for us. Yeah, with you
in spirit all the way, my friend. Thanks, George. Take care then. Bye. George Gleason
calling from Berkeley, California. 212-279-3400. This is the last program with fiber optic before
he's sent to prison for crimes of hacking crimes, which one day won't be considered crimes at all.
I'm positive about this. I mean, people that that kill people that rape people that rob.
Yeah, they they may get more time. They may not get more time. But, you know, they don't always
get very much more time than this. And lots of times first offenders of violent crimes, you know,
they they get less than what what we're sending this guy away for. It's it's a crazy world. It's
a crazy world. And we can't forget that for a second. Good evening. You're on. Oh, you were on.
Good evening. You're on. Yes. Hello. Go ahead. Yes. I'd like to say goodbye to fiber. And
you guys, Emmanuel, you're doing a very good program here. Very, very well. The signal comes
in here in Nassau County. And don't feel bad that you're going away because it's going to be an
experience that you will never forget. But it's all the people, innocent people and people with
a lot of ideas and different than the majority of the society that are locked away, wasting their
brains, wasting the energy, because this is a system in which we live in. And so I would like
to say, you know, do the best and hang in there. You guys, we need more people like you guys.
OK, thanks for calling. Thanks. Take care. You know, it's it's interesting. There have been
people in the past that have gone to prison for this kind of thing. Quite a few, actually way too
many. This for us here in New York, B.I. listeners in particular, it's different because we've come
to know this particular person. And I think in ways that that we can only try to point out with
other people that don't have voices and faces attached to them. We can see very clearly that
this is a human being. This is somebody that that shares our curiosity, shares our quest for
knowledge, shares our sense of humor, shares all that kind of thing. And now we see the effects
of sending somebody away like this, of totally disrupting someone's life, the sadness, the
incredible tragedy of something like this. And it takes that contact, takes that contact to be able
to to get through that particular idea, that particular way of seeing things. So if nothing
else, at least we all have benefited from from from knowing Fiber here, from interacting week
after week. We can all feel outraged at what's happening. We can all feel sadness and anger
together rather than just reading something in a newspaper about some faceless person someplace.
We all know this person, and it's like it's happening to us to some degree.
212-279-3400. Good evening, you're on. Yeah, Emmanuel, how you doing? Okay, how are you? Okay,
this is Reuben from the Bronx. How are you? Okay, and I'd like to say that I don't really
know Fiber too long, only from the past few meetings that I've been to. And I just think
that he should try to use the time to his advantage, you know, maybe work out a lot and
come out cocked diesel, you know what I'm talking about? I think so. Yeah, I think so. So anyway,
that's about all Fiber, you know, just try to read a lot, you know, and work out a lot and get
the number for that computer so we can hack into it. And, you know, maybe reduce the amount of days.
Okay, well, we'll work on that. All right, work on that. Thanks. Thanks a lot. All right. But
there's any, you know, governors or people listening like that, that can commute sentences,
I think they have more access to that system than we do. But it's interesting what the caller
mentioned in the next, or the issue of 2600 that just came out. We have something called the cool
letter department. And this guy, this person that was in prison and sent us a letter. I don't know
what he was in prison for. I'm not sure if it was hacker related. But he got a letter from the
sheriff's department saying, our office has recently received information that you or other
persons of your acquaintance may attempt to gain access to the computer system of the Travis County
Sheriff's Department. Now, this is a letter he received while he was in prison. He received a
letter from the sheriff's department saying don't access our computers to a prisoner. Somebody isn't,
I mean, that's incredible. What do they think this guy was capable of? So yeah, we got a copy of that
letter and what fun that was. But I don't think, I don't think such things will happen in this
particular case. Good evening, who are you? Where are you calling from? New York. Okay, and what's your
first name? Lynn. Sorry? What's your first name? Lynn. Okay, and what's on your mind? Oh, um, I just
want to say that we're going to miss you forever on Echo. Thanks. I can't hear you. So we're going
to miss you and take care and we'll come out and visit. Okay, see what you do. Bye-bye. Thanks for
calling. And, um, how does the visitor policy work? Basically, you have to give them a bunch of names?
As far as I know, when I, when I first get there, I go through some sort of orientation and I get the
opportunity to put four names on a list. Four names? I thought it was more like 12. No, it was four names I
was told and, um, I don't know what the exact rules are as far as, uh, if I can take someone off that
list or put them back on at a later time so I can put other people on. But basically, uh, just because
they're on that list doesn't mean much. That means that, uh, I'm willing to accept them as a visitor and
then if they want to actually show up, they have to go through some whole long process of filling out
forms and being approved by the prison and so on and so forth. That must be the ultimate insult,
not being approved by a prison. But, um, well, I just wanted to say something interesting on that
note is that I talked to, uh, my friend Paul Styra last night. He called us at Echo from prison. He's
in Lewisburg, Pennsylvania and, uh, he had said a couple interesting things. One thing he said was
particularly about you was that they had labeled you as a subversive. Oh, you don't say, really?
Really, yeah. Now, how is it he knows about this and I don't? This is what, uh, I believe he was told.
He was told I'm a subversive. Yeah, I don't know if it was in those exact words but they pretty much
alluded to it so I think... I suppose they mean that in a negative way. I think so, yeah. I think
you'd probably have problems getting approved for visitation. Oh, that's just great. I've been
told I'm a dissident, you know, in Bruce Sterling's book but, uh, subversive, boy. So, because I'm a
subversive, I can't visit people in prison now. That's... What am I going to do? Am I going to
lead an uprising or something? Am I going to tear down the walls? Show people the secret exit out?
He was also wondering if, uh, if you got a mail from him recently. Um, I got a letter from him
several weeks ago. Okay. Several weeks ago. I think it's a possibility he might have sent something
more recent and he's afraid that they might be, uh, diverting the mail between you and him. It's,
uh, it's quite possible. Um, I just sent him something so hopefully he'll get something in a
few days and, uh, I think whenever you send mail to somebody in prison, you always have to make
reference to something that you sent before so that they'll know if it's missing and the same
going the other way. So, when you write out to people, make sure that you mention if, um, if
you already sent out a piece of mail, you know, that that mail existed. Otherwise, we may never
know it's missing. I can't believe we're talking like this but, uh, that's, that's the way it is.
That's what we're dealing with. Subversive, huh? So, I guess that means that, uh, that they're not
gonna let me visit you. Is that it? I don't know. Uh, well, make sure you put my name on the list.
Oh, you'll certainly be on the list. With, with both Acid Freak and Scorpion who are, are two
other friends that are currently in jail and I guess will be getting out in March or April. Yeah.
Um, they both put my name on a list from what I understood and, um, either didn't hear anything
back or as you just told me, um, heard something to the negative back. Yeah. It's crazy. All right.
Let's go back to the phones. Good evening. You're on the air. Hi, Manuel. How you doing? Okay. Um,
I have a few now, you know, a few things to say. Um, first of all, I'm kind of wondering, uh, you
called zero and you still hear New York telephone. Now, I'm assuming that when you dial zero, it's
all going to the same office. Am I right? Because when you dial zero here, we get the 9x. Yeah. Now,
what area code are you in? 203. 203. Uh, 203. Yeah. You're in that small part of 203 that gets
served by 9x or New York telephone? Yep. In fact, if you want, I got three-way calling. I can
conference you with a new thing. Okay. Go ahead. Just a sec. I know there are some areas that are
getting it. Don't hang up when I'm done. Hang on. Okay. Of course. I hope he doesn't hang up.
Let's see what happens. This could be the first airing of the 9x. Wow. Wow. Doesn't that sound
nice and cheery? Can I help you? Uh, no thanks. No. All right. Anyway. Go back. Go back to work.
Okay. Uh, that's, that sounds really uplifting and something that we really could use in the
90s. Yeah. And the next thing is? 9x. It's like a sunrise. Um, uh, next few things. Uh,
Michigan Bell. Now, there's all this controversy about caller ID. Mm-hmm. Michigan Bell now has
caller ID where it also shows your name. Well, that's, that's happening throughout the country
actually. And the other thing that was weird, um, was that, uh, I think it's Pennsylvania Bell
that. That's Bell of Pennsylvania to you. What? Bell of Pennsylvania. Not Pennsylvania Bell. Bell
of Pennsylvania. Um, they now have a service where if you dial your own number. Uh-huh. It
will ring all the other phones in the house. Kind of like Ringback. Isn't that clever? Yeah. And
what I'm wondering is, wouldn't that, uh, wouldn't that do something to your phone if you're still
on the phone? Or I guess maybe they make you hang up or something? Well, you have to hang up the
phone for it to ring. Right. That's what I figured. Yeah. And then the deal is you hear it stop
ringing and you pick up and hope that in that half a second of confusion that the person doesn't hang
up again. Then the last thing is, uh, MCI. I was one, I was looking at 1010 Winds radio. Uh-huh.
They announced that MCI now has, uh, some sort of a thing where you can call when you make, uh,
calling card calls or whatever. Um, they now have voice recognition or they will, um, actually
the second last thing, um, they now has voice recognition where you're supposed to be able to
say your name. You can now get car, not a card, but I think that's Sprint. Oh, it might be Sprint.
I'm not sure. I think they said MCI, but, um, you're supposed to be able to call an 800 number.
It'll, they said it would ask for a code, which has confused me because it's supposed to be voice
activated. Well, it's probably a word of some sort. Yeah. And then after that you say call home
or third party or something like that. Yeah. But you might call Rome instead of calling home.
All kinds of things are possible with voice recognition. I was, I was talking about the, um,
uh, the, the Newton computer a couple of weeks ago. Now that's not voice recognition. That's
handwriting recognition. But, uh, occasionally when somebody would write the word, call Bob,
it would translate it to kill Bob. And you know, that caused all kinds of misunderstandings,
obviously. Yeah. All right. Thanks a lot. Okay. We'll miss you. All right. Take care.
Let's, uh, go back to the phones. Two one, two, two, seven, nine, three, 400.
Good evening. Where are you calling from? Hi, I'm calling from Manhattan. My name is Steve.
Okay. And I wanted to let Mark know he's never heard my voice before, but I know him from Echo.
My name is Steve Miller. Uh, also sharp. And, uh, Mark, uh, you, if you remember enough about
me, you know, I'm a computer programmer. I'm also in a criminal defense attorney.
I work mostly in the computer biz. I want to let you know that one of the effects that's intended
by, uh, imprisonment of course, is to send a message to society. In this particular case,
it's going to work in reverse at least some of the time, because many of my coworkers who are
computer people have read some of the partially accurate accounts of what you pled to and what
you were charged with. And they'd been scratching their heads and saying, you know, gee, I've done
that and I've done this and so forth. And maybe they didn't have names like fiber optic or were
members of groups or whatever that had, uh, uh, curious or suspicious sounding names.
But they started asking me, gee, could I really go to jail? If I were found out that I did this,
could I really be prosecuted? If we're found out, I did that. And I have to tell them that
under both federal and now some of the more stringent New York state laws, the answer is yes.
And I think they're scratching their heads some more and saying, well, that isn't right.
And, uh, the message being sent by the fact that someone who did the same things that they
haven't been caught for, but have also done is going to do a year. It's, uh, it's got them doing
more than just getting scared and saying, I better follow the law. I think a lot of them are saying
we better change the law. So, uh, whatever comfort it might be to you, uh, more than one message can
come out of somebody doing time. And this time it, uh, it's going to be different than they expect.
And, uh, for what it's also worth, I'm going to help try to send that message for you.
Um, I don't know if that'll give you any comfort in the can, but, uh, just be aware that we, uh,
we don't all see things the same way as our government. Okay. Thanks very much. Thanks.
Take care. I think that represents, uh, a large number of people out there from,
from all different backgrounds. I mean, we had somebody on the, uh, on the radio a few weeks
ago, former CIA person saying that this was outrageous. We have people from all different,
uh, departments and, and factions of the government saying this. Uh, I mean,
it doesn't make sense. I have to ask myself over and over again, who does this benefit?
You know, and if, if you believe sending someone like Fiber to prison is a good thing,
who benefits from this? Do we benefit? Now we're losing a voice for, for 10 months to a year. Um,
I have yet to find anyone that will benefit from this. Good evening. You're on, where are you
calling from? Yes. Go ahead. Hi. I just want to, uh, say that, uh, I know that Mark, it feels very
bad about having to go away. And, uh, those of us that have come to know him, uh, over the past year
are not having our liberties taken away from us for an extended period of time. Uh, but what's
being removed from our life is someone that for me has become very dear to me. Uh, I really like
Mark a whole lot. And when, uh, the news of his sentencing came down, it took a while for me to
realize what this was going to mean, you know, to Mark. And then recently as, as Friday has been
fast approaching us, I found that I've become very withdrawn, uh, because a friend of mine is
going away. And, uh, the line from the Mikado that comes to, comes to mind to me a whole lot is my
object. Oh, so blind. I will achieve in time to make the punishment fit the crime, the punishment
fit the crime. And I think that in this case it doesn't. And that's what I wanted to say.
Okay. Thanks. Sure. Take care. Yeah. Nothing like a Gilbert and Sullivan line to make you feel a
little better. Okay. 212-279-3400 goodbye show for fiber optic here on WBAI New York.
Good evening. You're on. I just called and I forgot to say one thing. Um, I found something
very interesting in New York telephone. All right. Make it quick. Cause there's a lot of people
waiting. All right. I'm sorry. Um, you can try this. I don't know what effects it'll have on
a rollover, but you can try it on your last line. Um, it seems that if you hang up and pick up and
hang up and pick up constantly, right. Uh, a little faster than a pole style. Yeah. It'll, it'll,
it'll kill the line. Not only that, but if you then go onto a different line and call that line,
your telephone will tell you if you have two lines that the number has been changed
and we'll list the other line. Really? That's that's bizarre. Yeah. You can try it. I mean,
I've done it, uh, two different lines and luckily on mine, if I know someone that I don't want to
talk to, I can do that because they typed in the number wrong. I also heard a rumor though,
that every time you do that, you kill a switchman. It's just a rumor. It's just a rumor,
but I felt I should point, you know, pass it along to everybody. You might want to try that or
Yeah, I'll try it. Thanks. Actually, I tried that in Kansas, not killing a switchman. I tried,
um, pulsing the phone real fast and it killed the line for a couple of minutes. And then I tried it
again and it didn't work anymore. It's like the line learned, learned not to react to that anymore.
And, um, I don't know. It happens on digital switches that much. I do know. Well,
pretty much happened on any switch and in the lingo, it's called a line shower.
And the reason why the line cuts off like that is that, uh, in case there's a short circuit,
it could cause a intermittent short like that. And they want to cut the line off
until they can repair it. Uh-huh. But if you do it enough times, I guess they label you a wise
guy and say, okay, we're not going to protect this person anymore. Just let him flash away
to his heart's content. Okay. Let's go back to the phones. Good evening. You're on.
Oh, that's me. But where are you?
Eric. Good evening. Hi. Hello. Um,
Manny. Yeah. Okay. I wanted to say goodbye to fiber. Um, as a tribute, I just watched a rerun
of the original max headroom pilot the other night. So I dedicate that to him. I have just
a brief question about a New York telephone horror story. Maybe you can give me some advice.
Are you aware of the optional wire maintenance charge that appears on the bill? Yes. It's
very optional, right? Well, um, they conned me into having the maximum amount because I have
four extent extensions. And a few months ago I called up and said, it's optional. I'm trying
to economize and minimize, please remove it. So what happened was they charged me a $10 order
charge and they didn't even remove it. So I'm still being charged. Plus I was charged $10
to process an order that didn't even go through. Um, what recourse do I have?
They charged you to remove something. I've never heard of that.
Something like an order or something. It was a $10 processing charge, but they can't,
they can't charge you the wire maintenance charge, right? They can't charge you to remove a feature.
They can charge you to add a feature to install a feature, even though there's no installation
required. So what do I do? I don't have the records or anything. Go to the front of your
phone book. You'll find several 800 numbers there. And I would take those step-by-step
since obviously, uh, customer service didn't help you out. Try the president's hotline of
the phone company. Let me ask you a question first. And after that, uh, try the public service
commission. If that, if they don't help you where fiber is going, he's going to a place called
school, kill Pennsylvania, which is a, uh, a federal pen, I guess. I was afraid of that.
Well, hopefully, you know, um, you can do some good works if you know what I mean,
out of their system, um, whatever. Okay. Well, it's, you know, I've enjoyed the show,
but your show will remain on, right? Yes. Until they come to get me, this show will remain on.
Okay. That's about it. Yeah. Okay. Being a, a, uh, what was the word again? Subversive. Yes.
Just want to make sure, uh, that they could come anytime, I guess. Right.
Do I get a copy at least of a piece of paper that says I'm a subversive? I think I'm entitled to
that, aren't I? I mean, subversives have rights too. What? We don't? Oh, I'm sorry. My mistake.
All right. 212-279-3400. Give us a call. Say goodbye to fiber optic. Good evening. You're on.
Hi, how are you? Okay. I'm just kind of calling to add my voice to the support for fiber.
Well, thanks. Um, yeah, I'm kind of new on echo, but I, I imagine most of the people in jail are
not going to have the kind of level of support behind you, you know, that you have any kind of
consolation. Well, I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing when you go to jail and you
have a fan club. Well, you know, maybe, you know, maybe it'll make you feel better. I mean,
you know, who cares what the other people think, right? That's true. Except you got
to live with those people for the next year. That's, that's the only concern there. Well,
if you're quiet and keep to yourself, they know what that means. So maybe they'll leave you alone.
Yeah. I don't know. It's, it's a minimum security though, right? Yeah. That shouldn't be,
it shouldn't be bad. Yeah. Well, you know, there's just something about the word prison,
I guess. I know it's kind of, it kind of rubs you the wrong way, right? You're going to get a warm
welcome when you get out. Yeah, that's for sure. You think the party going in was something,
the party coming out is going to be even better. Yeah. Yeah. All right. On echo,
everybody can't wait. I'm sure. Yeah. We'll start making plans now. We'll do. All right. Thanks.
212-279-3400. Good evening. You're on. Hello Fiber. Hi. Hi Fiber. Yep. Hey. Hey, I know who
this is. I hope in, in prison that the mashed potatoes don't have any skins. I hope so too.
Well, you know, we're all with you. Thanks. And good luck. I'll talk to you. Thanks a lot.
All right. Take care. Okay. Thanks. Thanks for calling. Good evening. You're on.
Hi. Hello. Go ahead. Just take up speaker over here. Let me just turn on the radio here.
Uh, you know, everyone's saying goodbye. We're going to miss you and stuff, but
there is a little bit of all of us in what's going on over here. And, uh, fiber just personifies it.
Uh, everyone has their own. Well, I have my own personal story with some stuff like this.
And, uh, I feel that as a part of me is going to prison to part of a part of society, if you will,
is going to prison here. Exactly. Yes. Another thing too, is I'm glad to hear from the guy
identified himself as a criminal attorney saying that he's going to try and do something at least
to, uh, decriminalize this, if you will, or at least mollify it because, uh, yeah, I mean, it's,
it's almost, if you will, the luck of the draw. I mean, you know, there's a lot of people that
could have gone to prison for the same thing. Really ridiculous. Number one, number two,
I know how you feel. And, um, and I'm not being cavalier about this because I know how you feel.
I mean, this is really not such a good thing. And the other thing is, as far as the people
who are violent, who go to jail versus the people who are nonviolent, who get the book thrown at
them, it's as if the, uh, from my perspective that the violent people basically use the prison
as, uh, a notch on their belt. The more years you can do, the more you're, uh, regarded as being,
uh, sort of like a big man on campus, so to speak. Whereas people who have, uh, jobs, if you will,
who are in society, who are paying taxes and stuff, this really hurts. And it, it, it makes
more, it inflicts more of a damage on people who are more, if you will, law abiding or in a gray
zone than those people who are flagrant and violent about it. And that's how I feel.
All right. Thanks for calling. Thanks.
Good evening. You're on.
Yeah. Hi. I want to add my voice to the support for fiber. Um,
I could pretty much echo everyone's prior statements. Also a couple of days ago on Monday,
um, I called and I did get the nine X from Long Island, Nassau County.
Oh, good for you.
That's all I have to say. Good luck, Piper.
Thanks.
Take care. Yeah. It seems that, uh, the nine X, uh, the nine X web is expanding slowly, but surely.
Good evening. You're on.
Hello.
Go ahead.
Yeah. This is the silver back up in seven one eight. Uh, like to say hello to manual razor,
Roman and, uh, fiber. And I do wish a fiber the best of luck with his, uh,
his little trip for his 10 months there. And, uh, I'd like to add my voice to the other people
on echo that are going to miss him and, uh, really miss him a bad, uh, being a, you know,
what I got, you know, guys know what I used to do for a living being a formal federal officer.
I can honestly say that fiber is the only guy that I've ever felt sorry for going to prison,
including, uh, you know, a lot of the people that I sent up personally.
But, uh, I think that the, the movement that he represents, the 2600 is a good thing.
I'm personally have an interest in it. Uh, I think it's great to expose the ripoffs of
the phone companies, uh, ripoffs of the co-cod companies, uh, and so on and so forth. And I
think it's a good thing. I don't think this is subversive information being translated at all.
Well, I, I agree with you. I know there's people in power though, that don't, and that's,
that's what the problem is right now.
Yes. I agree also. It's, uh, right now it's up to the people in power,
but we did bring down the bell system and, uh, working on AT&T and the rest of the companies
out there and hopefully we'll get fair and equal treatment by them. Some, somewhere along the line.
Yeah. One of these days, hopefully, hopefully that will happen.
Okay. That's all I have to say.
All right. Take care.
Good night.
Well, um, any, uh, any particular plans, uh, for things you want to accomplish while you're away,
things you want to do, things you don't want to do. Have you thought about this?
Things I want to do while I'm away?
Yeah. You planning on, uh, on reading and, uh, writing?
Well, hopefully I can, uh, accept at least half of the books that people say that they,
they'd like to send me. In fact, I'm reminded of, uh, my discussion with, uh, with Paul last night
calling from prison who said that a mutual friend of ours sent him a, uh, a programming, uh, book
about, uh, the C++ programming language. He wasn't allowed to receive it. The person who, uh,
who, uh, okay's the, uh, the receipt of, of things in the mail was saying that he thought
it was very strange and, uh, he, he was, uh, confused by it. So he was holding it back from
Paul.
I see. Now that's just great when you have someone who's, uh, who's into, uh, computer
development being denied access to computer development while you're away. You know, it's
a lot is going to be happening in 10 months. I mean, if you don't have access to at least the
knowledge of what's going on out there, it's going to be like a completely different planet
when you get back. 10 months is a long time in the, in the development of telecommunications
and computers. So, um, I sure hope that we're able to get stuff like that through to you.
Yeah. That's a pretty important to me that I'm able to keep track of the
new technology going on and back in the real world.
Mm hmm. Now there was a, there was a rule as far as, uh, sending publications or sending
books that they can only come from the publisher. Is that true?
Yeah. If they, if they were hardcover books, they can only come directly from a publisher.
And I guess, I guess they fear that people will hide things in the binding or something.
Yeah, subversives out there will, uh, will hide things in the hardcover books somehow. And, um,
and publishers of course, won't do this. So if anybody out there has friends, uh, or themselves
works in the publishing house, uh, that can manage to send, um, hardcover books or softcover
books or magazines or anything, uh, to Fiverr, please, uh, look into it and we'll be giving
out the address. Uh, you don't have your address yet, do you?
No, I actually, all I have really is the address of the prison itself for purposes of getting there,
but I'm not really going to know my specific address until I'm there and I'm assigned quarters.
Okay. We'll update the folks as we learn more about that.
Good evening. You're on.
Yeah. Hi. I just wanted to say, um, another echoid who's going to miss Fiverr. Uh,
I just hope that, uh, things work out for him.
Okay. Thanks.
Keep the faith. And I also want that infrared band if he doesn't mind.
Okay.
Take care.
All right.
Bye.
I guess he's got dibs on that now.
Good evening. You're on.
Oh good. I'm so glad I got on. Fiverr?
Yeah.
Hey, Fiverr.
Hi.
So, um, I'm going to miss you for sure because you've taught me a lot.
Uh-huh.
And, um, I just want to say one last thing to you and to Emmanuel. Well, it won't be a last
thing to Emmanuel, but if you dial 3-1-1, it gives you some sort of a strange sound,
not touch tones, but a strange sound. You could dial it now.
Are you sure? Are you sure we can dial it now?
Yes.
I don't know about that. All right. I'll, I'll take you up on it.
Um, actually, wait, do we have touch tones now? Do you have touch tones?
Well, you could dial it on dial too. I mean, it doesn't matter.
Yeah, but we don't have a way of dialing on this particular line because all the lines are taken up.
Maybe you can dial for us.
I can't dial it here because I'm in Queens. It only works in Manhattan.
Ah, it's too bad.
Well, gosh, um, we'll have to do it with you off the line then.
That's the only way I can free up a line.
Well, you want to tell us what happens?
I don't have a recorder. I'm about to compile a recording of different switches, by the way,
for you.
Uh-huh.
That's great, but why don't you, why don't you describe for us what happens?
And, uh, it sounds like a Morse code type of thing.
Morse code, huh?
Yeah, for a split second and then it, uh, hangs up.
Really? All right, we'll check it out.
Okay, Spider, uh, best of luck and, uh, I, I'm going to miss you.
Oh, thanks.
All right, take care.
Take care. Thanks for calling.
All right, let's, uh, let's give that a try. Let's get a line here,
which hopefully has touch tone service.
All right, we're gonna dial 3-1-1.
See what happens.
I have a feeling nothing's gonna happen.
Well, what do you know?
It's busy.
It's busy. Well, either that means that everybody in the world is trying that right now, or, uh,
it probably just doesn't work from here.
Or, you know, if you think about it, that busy signal does sound a bit like Morse code.
Well, yeah, if you slow it down enough, there's probably some sort of a code in there.
All right, let's go back to the phones.
2-1-2, 2-7-9, 3-4-100, good evening, you're on.
Uh, yes, Emmanuel.
I just want to wish Fiber a, uh, you know, good luck in jail and all, and, uh,
you know, just basically want to wish that.
Okay, well, thanks for calling.
Sorry, that was me.
Okay, good evening, you're on.
Yes, hello.
I would just like to echo everyone else's words and, uh, the support of Fiber.
And the only thing I'd like to add to it is don't let them shatter your mind.
I hope you can use this time to your advantage to, uh,
to enhance whatever you can.
Again, if you can get some reading material or whatnot.
And I do have one quick question for you guys.
Okay.
Oh, I'm sorry, are you there?
Yeah.
I'm trying to get the 2600 magazine.
Can you give me, uh, any idea how I can get it?
I've been trying to do it for a long time.
You want to find it in an e-stand or do you want to subscribe?
I would subscribe, really.
Okay, I'll give you the phone number.
That's, uh, area code 516-751-2600.
751-2600.
Thank you very much.
Okay, take care.
Good evening, you're on.
Uh, hi, I'd just like to voice my, uh...
Can you speak up a bit?
Uh, I'd just like to say goodbye to, uh, Fiber.
Eric!
I don't know.
I don't know what's going on out there.
Okay, 212-279-3400.
That's our phone number.
Good evening, you're on.
Hello?
Yes, go ahead.
How you doing, Fiber?
Hi, how are you?
I'm gonna miss you, man.
Thanks.
If I were you, I'm gonna buy a radio.
Hello?
Yes, go ahead.
And listen to Nightshade.
Nightshade!
Okay, good evening, you're on.
Hi, you know, um, I'm, um, listening to all the people saying, uh, goodbye to Fiber.
You know, the, um, Fiber's gonna be back in, in 10 months and, uh, uh, I, I certainly wish
him well, and I will miss hearing his voice on the air, but, uh, you know, uh, Fiber,
I think if you look at this, it's kind of like an interesting experience.
Uh, you know, not, not one of your own choosing, but, uh, it'll be something to, to, to observe
and to, uh, um, to, uh, to, uh, experience it, you know, as, as, as something, something
brand new.
And, uh, um, I don't know too much about, uh, Scorpio, but, uh, if it's a minimum security,
well, and, um, it's not exactly like doing time at, uh, Leavenworth or, you know, some,
some of these really, uh, really, uh, atrocious prisons.
And, uh, do, you know, as people say, make the most of your time, make, do the best you
can, and, uh, he will be looking, looking for you when you, when you, when you come
out.
Okay, thanks for your call.
Good evening, you're on.
Where are you calling from?
Yeah, Emmanuel?
Yes, go ahead.
Yeah, this is Craig.
Craig Neidorf?
Yeah.
Are you calling from, uh, from Washington or Virginia?
Well, yeah.
Okay, one of those places, we'll just leave it at that.
Uh, well, Craig, yeah, we've, um, you know, you're a familiar voice to this, uh, radio
program, having been, uh, prosecuted yourself.
Uh, you, you got out of it successfully, though.
Um, we're in the last minute of the program.
Something, uh, you want to convey?
Yeah, sorry I'm late.
What's on your mind?
Well, is Mark still there?
I'm right here.
Hey, Mark, how you doing?
How's it going?
Okay.
I, uh, just wanted to wish you the best of luck.
Well, thanks a lot.
I mean, I don't know exactly what's the deal with where you're heading or anything, but,
uh, make sure we all have your address.
Yep, I'll, I'll make sure everyone gets it.
Okay, well, we, uh, we'll certainly be sending that out over the net and over the radio as
well.
Um, but, uh, Craig, I know you, you speak for a lot of, uh, of hackers out there that
are following this whole thing and are, feel pretty much the same way as we do here at
VAI and our listeners do.
Um, and, uh, I want to thank you for calling.
All right.
Well, like I said, I mean, I feel pretty bad about what's going on because I was once almost
right there.
All right.
Well, thanks again.
Yeah.
Talk to you guys later.
All right.
Take care.
Thanks for calling.
Um, Craig Neidorf, who, uh, a couple of years ago was, uh, threatened with the same thing
that, uh, FiberOptic is facing right now, prison for, uh, access.
Actually, in his particular case, it was, it was, he was facing prison for printing
information that the phone company said was secret and it turned out later that it was
not.
Who knows what will turn out to be, uh, the case later on in this particular, uh, chain
of events.
Um, it's, uh, pretty likely though that in future years, we'll, uh, look upon this as,
uh, a big waste of everybody's time.
A real tragedy, something that, uh, should not have happened.
And, uh, I know I speak for, uh, for VAI listeners and saying that, uh, this is a, a sad
day.
This is something that, uh, that we're not going to forget about for quite some time.
And hopefully, uh, Fiber will be, uh, in touch with you on a regular basis.
We'll, uh, be reading your letters hopefully every week here at this radio station.
And, um, hey, in 10 months, we're going to see you again right here.
All right.
And thanks very much for, uh, for everything you've given us over the past, uh, couple
of years.
Thanks for just being there and answering our questions and having your unique perspective.
I wish it didn't have to be this way.
Wish, uh, we could, uh, continue doing this without an interruption.
Unfortunately, the, um, the forces of darkness sometimes, sometimes they make the moves and
we have to follow.
And this is one of those cases.
Let's hope, uh, it doesn't stay that way for, um, for a whole lot longer.
So Fiber, this is, uh, this is it.
Yep, this is it.
Yep.
This is it.
All right.
Take care.
And, uh, we'll see you in, uh, in 10 months or so.
Yep.
I'll see everyone around.
All right.
This is Emanuel for Off The Hook.
We'll be back next week.
We'll let you know how things went.
Take care of yourselves.
Stay tuned for the news.
Be good.
Good night.
Be good.
Good night.
Good night.
Good night.
So
this is radio station WBAI in New York.
Stay tuned for the evening news tonight on Earthwatch.
Robert Knight returns live with a report from Rikers Island.
Stay tuned.
Good evening.
In the news tonight, the Mexican government delivers a crushing blow to a Mexican rebel
movement.
North Korea bows to U.S. pressure.
And in New York, a victory for environmentalists in Harlem while Governor Cuomo calls for more
firepower to fight crime.
With these and other stories, I'm Jose Santiago in New York with Verna Avery-Brown in Washington.
And this is the news for Wednesday, January 5th, 1994.
First to Washington and these headlines topping the news.
It's official.
State Department spokesperson Lynn Davis says North Korea has agreed to allow inspection of
its nuclear sites.
The decision puts North Korea in accordance with the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty or
NPT.
Washington has been pushing North Korea to open its facilities for inspection since Pyongyang
threatened last March to withdraw from the NPT.
The CIA believes the Asian country has produced at least one nuclear weapon.
There are conflicting reports about the early resumption of talks between Israel and the PLO
over a partial Israeli withdrawal from the occupied territories.
Peretz Kadron reports from Jerusalem.
Israeli sources reject the