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And you're listening to WBAI in New York.
It's one minute after 9 o'clock, and that means it's time for Off the Hook.
The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
It couldn't get much worse, but if they could, they would.
Von Diddley Bond for the best, expect the worst.
I hope that's understood. Von Diddley Bond!
And a very good evening to one and all.
This is Emanuel Goldstein.
The program is Off the Hook, where we talk about high tech and low intelligence and various
things like that.
What will the future be like?
And how will you play a part in it?
We'll be talking about that.
We'll be going over some of our terms at the popular request of many of our listeners.
But first, here's one look at the future.
I'll get you as populator of the planet we call Earth.
In suspended animation, my childhood passed me by.
If I speak without emotion, then you'll know to listen why.
The knowledge of the universe is fading to my mind.
I start to have a lesson, having left the stupidity behind.
And everything I know is what I need to know.
And everything I do has been done before.
Every sentence in my head that someone else has said.
I'm getting fed up, my life is an open door.
I was romantically defrosted when manhood came on time.
I became a man, I left the ice cold behind.
Now I'm to begin the life that I'm assigned.
A life that's been used before a thousand times.
I have a feeling deep inside that something is missing.
It's a burning in my soul and I can't help wishing.
But one day I'll discover that we're living a lie.
And I'll tell the whole world the reasons why.
And until then, all I know is what I need to know.
And everything I do has been done before.
Every idea in my head that someone else has said.
I'm getting fed up, my life is an open door.
And that's The Who starting us off here on Off The Hook with a song called 905.
Will we be reduced to numbers in the future? Oh yes, most definitely.
The only question is which numbers will we be reduced to and how many?
That's what we're here to discuss, that's what we're here to help hash out on the program as always.
Emmanuel Goldstein with you until 10 o'clock.
We'll be taking phone calls at 212-279-3400
if you have any questions, comments, observations or information to pass on to us.
And we'll be taking a look at exactly, or sort of, what's been going on around here in the world in various forms of media.
For instance, this piece from the Boston Globe of December 30th, 1991.
They report that a disgruntled Honda owner called its Better Business Bureau information line toll-free customer relations number so many times that he clogged the line.
He did the same to other 900, excuse me, 800 numbers.
Fatal slip there, and I'll tell you why it's a fatal slip in a second.
He did the same to other 800 numbers used primarily by Honda employees and dealers.
Somehow he got all their numbers.
In both cases he presumably used an automatic redialing mechanism, sometimes known as a demon dialer.
He then began tying up a Honda facsimile number, known as fax machines to most people,
by transmitting multi-page letters during a four-day period.
American Honda Motor Company says that it was forced to ask AT&T to step in and block the calls, which allegedly came from a Holliston, Massachusetts home.
However, AT&T security said that it also had to block any calls to the Honda numbers for the entire 508 area code, which covers west and north of Boston.
Attempts to reach the Holliston complainer were not possible because the phone was unlisted.
There's a few things wrong with this story. I don't know if it leaps out at you as dramatically as it does to me,
but I somehow doubt the phone company would be unable to reach somebody because their number was unlisted.
Just somehow doesn't make sense to me.
There are also questions being raised as to whether or not caller ID might have helped prevent this.
Well, I can tell you right here and now, caller ID wouldn't have made a blessed bit of difference here.
For one thing, when you're using 800 numbers, you have the capability of finding out immediately the number of the person calling you.
And if not immediately, everybody has the capability of finding out when they get their phone bill, and they see all the numbers that called them.
No extra machinery to install to get that particular option.
So, using this as a call for caller ID is unfair, to say the least.
Continuing to other interesting stories here.
Postal information.
This is from a contributor to the Risks Digest, Douglas Jones, I believe at the University of Iowa.
I recently asked at my post office how many houses share the same ZIP plus 4 code with my house.
The answer was that if I lived in a single family dwelling, I almost certainly have a unique ZIP plus 4 code.
I note that the United States Postal Service, known here to with as USPS, now provides a complete database of ZIP plus 4 addresses in the country.
It's on CD-ROM, and it's included in the postal exhibit in Chicago's Museum of Science and Industry, where you can type in your address as you would on a letter.
And it gives you your ZIP plus 4 in response.
I tried it on my address here in Iowa, and it worked correctly.
In fact, I believe they have one downtown at the 24-hour post office.
At least they did a couple of years ago.
Now, the risk that Doug Jones sees in this is that statistical data that has traditionally been available sorted by ZIP code, like census data, may be released broken down by ZIP plus 4 codes.
And if this is done, it destroys any promise of confidentiality for such data.
Of course, there is a benefit.
You should be able to send mail to me with only a ZIP plus 4, no need to mention city, state, street, or house number.
Someday, you won't even have to mention a name.
Just write down your number, and they'll either call you on your wristwatch telephone or just deliver a piece of paper to you no matter where you are.
And finally, today a bit on infrared bar-coded security cards that can be forged by laser printers.
Now, this is posted by a fellow in Australia.
Well, to be honest, it's either Australia or Austria.
I'm not quite certain what...
See, on the Internet, on the computer network known as Internet, there are two-letter codes at the end that indicate countries other than the U.S.
The United States doesn't have a two-letter code because, well, I guess we're just number one or something.
But, for instance, the Netherlands is NL.
The Soviet Union, those few connections that they do have is SU.
Actually, I guess that will have to change.
I don't know what they're going to do about that.
But what we have here is AU.
So AU is either Australia or Austria.
I'm not 100% certain which it is.
But anyway, it came from George Michelson and speaks in rather a bizarre way, so you can make whatever judgment you wish.
They handed the cards out in alphabetical order to staff and the barcodes slash card numbers were congruent and the batch was sorted.
Skilled person, not self, examined three in sequence, calculated trivial encryption and checked some algorithm used,
inferred card for senior member of staff, used public domain code to generate barcode strip on Apple LaserWriter,
glued to card and swiped through lock.
Bingo! Instant access to secured areas, leaving calling card of self same high up all over the online logs.
I feel like I'm reading a bit of Neuromancer here.
Infrared readers also handle normal light codes.
Good eyes can read thick slash thin sequences in strong light.
So even if numeric code on card doesn't match bars, it's forgeable.
Infrared also pretty trivial to obtain and I really think the local admin slash security people have been blinded by science.
Apart from anything else, the electromagnets which operate the door locks look very subvertible.
Nothing new there, George.
Another instance of hindering the novice and legitimate.
Whilst barely impeding anybody intent on skullduggery.
Ain't it the truth?
Good normal law-abiding God-fearing people are the ones that pay the price and are inconvenienced by technology,
but those that know how to get around it aren't affected in the least.
And it's for those people that we're here tonight.
Now, we've been asked on many occasions to please define our terms.
Less politely, we're asked, what the hell are we talking about?
There's so many little things and so few people are able to get what it is that we mean.
So tonight, we're going to be defining our terms.
In a rather blatant way, we're going to actually show you what we mean when we say certain things.
And that way there shouldn't be any problem.
In fact, maybe you should get out a tape recorder or something so we won't ever have to do this again.
And you can spread it around town and everybody will know what we're talking about from here on.
With regards to a few things, obviously we can't define everything, but it sure would make life a lot simpler.
These are things that people should know.
They should have known for 10 years now.
And it's about time that everybody knows this.
Everybody from your grandmother to your five-year-old son.
Everybody should know what these sounds that you hear on the telephone are.
And you phone company operators out there that have the radio turned up, you should know what these mean.
And I know a lot of you don't know what they mean.
Because oftentimes, you've got me on the line and I ask you, what's that noise?
And usually the response is, well, the phone must be broken.
And no, the phone is not broken.
The phone is engaged in a form of high technology that you're not aware of.
And you're being left behind in the 18th century.
And my patience has begun to wear thin.
All right, let's take a journey.
Let's look at various terms that we use all the time.
These are things people know.
I mean, everybody knows what a dial tone sounds like.
All right, thank you very much.
Yes, that's a dial tone.
That's what a dial tone sounds like.
And that's the sound you get when you pick up your phone.
That's pretty much the sound everybody gets when they pick up their phone.
It used to be different sounds in various areas.
But that's pretty much the sound everybody gets.
And that's pretty much what happens if you let it go on for too long.
Or it gives you a horrible sound.
Or men come to your door.
And, you know, various things happen if you leave your phone off the hook.
We don't advise it.
But there's other things that happen after you get the dial tone.
You can call things.
You can connect to things.
You can make your phone do magical tricks.
Now, let's take a listen to a typical ring.
All right, we're going to call up a number.
And hear what a typical ring sounds like.
And I'd like everybody to take note of this.
Why do we have our dial tone back?
You know, I'll tell you, the BAI phone system, it always...
Okay, I think we got it now.
All right, I think I messed up that time.
Let's try this one more time.
Let's hope this works.
The simple thing of dialing the phone can be a real challenge here.
Okay, that is a phone ringing.
Let's take a good listen to that.
All that noise is the BAI connection.
And that's what's basically known as static on the line, as an electronic ring.
Also known as ESS, electronic switching system, or digital switching even.
They all kind of sound exactly the same.
Which is a shame, really, because they don't have to all sound exactly the same.
But that's another issue altogether.
Now, it should be pretty simple to tell the difference between an electronic ring...
Thank you.
And a mechanical ring.
Now, what we're going to hear next is a mechanical ring.
Electromechanical ring from a...
I believe this is a number 5 crossbar office.
And you'll hear the very definite difference here.
Note the click at the end and the different sound effect.
That's a number 5 crossbar, ancient, from at least the 1950s.
And let's take a listen to one more.
Where shall we go for this one?
Okay, that's a number 1 crossbar.
And obviously, people should be able to tell the difference between those particular rings.
It doesn't really make any difference, except you know that people that don't have the first ring...
are unable to get things like call waiting and neat little services like that.
Okay, busy signals are important too.
It's important to know the difference between busy signals, what they sound like.
So you know when you're actually getting a busy signal and when you're not getting a busy signal.
Alright, now this is a typical busy signal.
I think we've all heard this noise millions of times.
That is an electronic busy signal, I guess is the best way to describe that.
But that's coming from an electronic office or a digital office.
A busy signal from a non-electronic office, a mechanical office.
And by office, that's a term for the phone company.
Every phone number goes through an office at some point.
And that is a mechanical busy signal.
Doesn't sound quite as smooth.
And you can also hear a click at the beginning and at the end.
Okay, let's listen to one more variation of that.
I'll give you a pretty thorough demonstration.
That's another mechanical busy signal.
So now we know the difference between electronic rings, mechanical rings, electronic busy signals, mechanical busy signals.
Now, here's where it starts to get interesting.
When is a busy signal not a busy signal?
When it's a reorder.
What's a reorder?
Well, keep in mind the noise we just heard, the electronic busy signal.
Get that back in your head, because we're going to call something that's a slight variation of that.
And we just lost the connection again because of this amazing wiring job here.
I don't know who to blame, the phone company, or, well, we'll get into that later.
Okay, this sounds very similar to the busy signal we heard.
But it's different.
Note it's faster.
And we can get the same exact noises from those other offices that we called.
We're not going to go through that because it'll just take too long.
But it's a fast version of a busy signal.
And that is gotten not when your phone is busy, but when you have failed to get through to the phone number that you've called.
For instance, if I was to call my house, say, and for some reason all of the circuits were busy going out to wherever it is I'm calling, I might get that.
I'd either get that or a recording.
Now, the busy signal is a particular, steady, repeating tone.
This is a faster repeating tone, indicating that something is wrong somewhere along the line.
So it's important, if you get an operator on the line, the operator tells you the line is busy, and you hear a noise like that, you know the line is not busy.
You know the line is having trouble being reached at some point.
Now, where that reorder is coming from, it's hard to say.
It depends on a lot of things.
It could be coming from your local phone system that you're calling out of.
It could be coming from something that you're not supposed to dial.
We have that here at BAI, if you try dialing things.
Let me try this.
I've never actually tried dialing something I'm not supposed to dial here at the radio station.
Oh, it just hung up immediately.
Let's try that again.
That's interesting. It rings immediately.
You see, I got that by dialing one digit.
So you can get that from your local system.
You can get that at any point between the calling phone and the called phone.
You can get a reorder.
But a busy signal, technically, should only be coming from the phone itself, if it's off the hook for whatever reason.
Okay. Hopefully that clears people up on that troubling thing.
I find that to be one of the most confusing aspects of telephone lingo that people can fathom.
It's extremely important to know when you're actually hearing a real busy signal and when you're not.
That way you won't be led around by the nose.
Okay. Something interesting. This is just for, I guess, informational sake.
There are different things called intercept recordings.
Intercept recordings are things I'm sure we've all heard occasionally.
Take a listen to this one.
Oh, not again. This is starting to annoy me.
This should not be happening.
We live in the 20th century here. We should be able to dial a telephone.
I've got all these heartbreaks.
Okay. Here we go.
The number you have reached, 279-3400, has been changed.
The new number is...
No, no, no. We're not going to give out any information like that.
But that is a voice we've heard many, many times.
It's the intercept recording.
It's a mechanical or actually automated service, as I'm sure 99% of us would figure out on our own.
And it basically tells us what has happened to certain numbers that we're trying to reach, that we can no longer reach.
I'm going to introduce you to a second lady that says the exact same thing in other parts of the country as well as this part as well.
Completely different person.
The number you have reached, 279-3400, is not in service.
In area code...
Okay. We're not going to give that away.
Different person, same basic message.
Occasionally, you'll find weird ones that are totally different, that are unique only to one or two areas in the country.
And in a moment, we're going to hear one of those.
The number you have reached, 279-3400, is not in service.
Please check the number and dial again.
The number you have reached, 279-3400, is not in service.
Please check the number and dial again.
The number you have reached, 279-3400, is not in service.
Please check the number and dial again.
Sounds like she's from Lost in Space or something.
Okay. So that's intercept recordings.
Now we know rings, busy signals, reorders, and intercept recordings.
Intercept recordings, if you really want to be cool, are sometimes called AISs.
Automatic intercept something or other.
Okay. Now, homestretch here.
We're going to take phone calls if people have any questions or comments on all this.
Or any additional bits of information they'd like to pass along, too.
Now, if you call something and you get a strange noise, and you want to know what it is, well, we might be able to help you with that.
There's different types of devices that you can be connected to.
And when the new 917 area code begins sometime this year, I believe May or June it will be starting up,
that area code will be devoted entirely to various high-tech items, a couple of which we're going to show you right now.
Okay. The first thing you're probably going to run across are fax machines.
Fax machines are every place.
And it's important to know what they sound like, because if you reach one, you want to know if you're talking to an answering machine
or just something that cannot possibly understand a human voice.
So what you're about to hear now is the sound of a fax machine picking up.
Oh, no.
Okay. After I dial the number all over again, you'll hear...
Oh, it hung up on me this time.
Will you please send us money so we can get a real phone system here? Thank you.
This is embarrassing, is what this is.
Okay. We made it.
Okay. That's a fax machine.
And what an impressive fax machine that was.
Now, keep that noise in your head. Don't let it escape, because we're going to play something that's very similar but very different.
And that's what's known as a computer modem.
It has a very similar sound to it, but obviously it goes to a completely different device.
And if you listen carefully, if you have a good ear, you'll be able to easily tell the difference between these two devices.
Okay. That was a computer modem, a slow-speed computer modem.
We're going to now play a high-speed computer modem.
And those of you who are really good will have no trouble differentiating all three of these noises.
All right. That was the BA iPhone system hanging up on us yet again.
Let's try this one more time.
Yes, the high-speed computer modem.
Now we know fax machines, computer modems, but there's one more thing left for us to learn before we go to the phone calls.
And that's the exciting world of beepers.
Yes, there's beepers to be found out there, and occasionally you will find one.
And it's important to know what they are when you find one.
This is what a beeper sounds like when you connect to it.
All right. If you get the beeps and it just pauses, it's waiting for you to key in some digits.
And always finish with a pound sign.
And it will acknowledge by beeping some more.
Now, if you find another kind of a beeper, there's all kinds of different ones out there.
Some will make radically different noises than what we just heard.
You can also call what is known as a tone-only service.
That does not allow you to enter a phone number when you connect to it.
And that's what this next one will sound like.
Eventually, if it ever connects.
Okay, well this time I don't think it was the BAI phone system at fault. I think New York Telephone failed us.
Not bad. We made about ten phone calls and no failures, so I guess that's above average for the phone company.
Let's give that another try and see how we fare connecting to a beeper that does not take input.
Notice there is no pause to allow you to put in numbers.
And it hung up on us.
Those are all the sounds that you can hear these days if you make phone calls a lot and connect to things that sometimes you don't intend to connect to.
There are lots and lots of operators still that will hear those noises and tell you that the phone is out of order.
They may even go so far as to report the phone out of order, thinking that they're doing you a favor when in actuality they're really hindering things quite a bit.
So now we know how to differentiate between a busy, a reorder, we know modems, we know fax machines, we know beepers, we know intercept recordings.
And now I think we're ready for the 90s.
212-279-3400. If you call that number now, you'll probably get a busy signal and you should know what that sounds like.
But if you keep calling and keep trying, you'll probably get an electronic ring and you should know what that sounds like as well.
Any questions? Give us a call now. Any comments? Give us a call.
I'd like to throw it open to the first intelligent caller out there that can answer this question correctly.
And these are one of many of our consumer tips that we like to give out on this program.
How can you call, this is within New York, how can you call 411, which is directory assistance, without paying for it?
And I should add, legally as well.
Alright, that's our question for the night. Feel free to call up with any questions of your own.
Alright, let's go to the phones.
Good evening.
Yes, hello?
How you doing?
Okay, I don't know the answer to that question.
Okay, that's alright. We don't think any lower of you.
What I want to talk about is, you remember New York Telephone got a rate increase at the end of the 1990s.
It sticks in my head like a nail, yes.
Well, it was announced at that time that there would be a second and third stage of the introduction of higher rates, or different rates.
And what I don't think anyone knows is what's going on right now.
The commission...
...and come up with a settlement agreement to stabilize, if possible, the rates for the years 1992 and 1993.
Proceedings are going on right now.
And it's interesting who's involved in the proceedings and who isn't.
For instance, you have the big banks, very well represented by very competent legal counsel.
Some very large corporations are very well represented.
The public statewide is extremely well represented by the Consumer Protection Board
and the Department of Law.
Then we have Erie County, the City of Buffalo, and Nassau County are very much involved in this.
And the City of New York, that telecommunications and energy committee, is doing some very fine work in the case.
The one county that has a lot of residents who pay phone bills of various kinds but isn't represented,
they're in the higher echelon of ratepayers, not as high as Nassau, by the way, or Erie County.
That's Westchester County.
And the reason I mention all this, if there are people who live in Westchester County and pay phone bills,
they might ask their county executives and so forth, the county law department.
I imagine there's quite a few people in Westchester that are paying phone bills
and would be most indignant to realize they're not being represented.
Yeah.
There's no excuse for that.
And, of course, the rest of upstate New York and so forth, I don't see them at these meetings.
But there should be some interesting announcements coming out about this.
The phone company, for instance, has announced that they've arranged for early retirement
for large numbers of non-management and management people,
and this is going to give them savings in the multi-millions of dollars,
which will mean that their requirement for a rate increase may be lessened by that factor alone.
And those things are being investigated.
And if it doesn't come out of the agreement, we may have initiated several parties,
like the Department of Law and Consumer Protection Board,
might initiate a rate reduction application before the commission.
But right now, I just wanted to give you a listener.
You do a fantastic job with the telephones,
and I wanted to give everybody a status report of what's going on so far.
Okay.
Thanks very much for calling.
You're welcome.
279-3400 is our phone number.
And, you know, I have no trouble with early retirement for some people,
particularly the people that keep calling me, asking me if I want to get call waiting.
I keep calling once every two months or so, saying,
well, do you want to get call waiting installed?
And every time they call, I say, sure, sign me up.
And, of course, two weeks later, I get a call from somebody else saying,
well, sir, you can't get call waiting in your area.
You would think that somewhere they would have a little chart that tells them not to call people in this area
because they can't possibly get call waiting, but no, they do not.
And they have these people waste their time calling every number in an exchange over and over again
to ask them questions that don't even pertain to them.
So, yeah, I don't have any trouble with early retirement for them or for the people that set them loose.
279-3400, always keep your eyes open for rate increases and things like that
and what the phone company is trying to get away with.
Rate reductions are something that we should be looking at in the 1990s.
In all honesty, there's little reason why the rates cannot be rolled back.
Good evening.
Hello.
Yes.
I think I have the answer to your question.
Okay, what's the answer to the question, which was,
how do you dial 411 in New York without paying for it?
First, I think they switched over to 555-1212.
Well, either one will work.
Okay, and the way I get it free is from any pay telephone.
That's correct.
Well, not from any pay telephone, mind you.
Oh, really?
Not from any pay.
If you do that from what's known as a COCOT, which is a customer-owned coin-operated telephone,
which is a non-New York telephone pay phone,
it's very likely they'll charge you up to 50, maybe even 75 cents for a call to information.
However, public service commission rulings state that they have to keep a phone book on the premises,
either next to the phone or somewhere on the premises of the organization that owns the phone,
which is usually the corner shop or whatever.
So if they don't do that, they're in violation.
Okay.
Also, I had a question.
Yeah.
You know, the intercept recording that you played, I live in Westchester, 914 area code.
And at the end of the recording, they give the recording that you played, and they say 9141T.
Right.
I don't know what they mean by that.
Well, that's a New York telephone recording that you're getting,
and that's simply a locator basically telling you where the recording is emanating from.
What are you trying to call when you get that?
Well, it's usually the number is out of service or it's been switched to another number.
Uh-huh.
And, you know, they give the number that it's switched to.
Uh-huh.
It's basically telling you where the recording is coming from.
And it's useful if, say, during an earthquake or something, you're trying to call California,
and you get a recording that says 7021T.
Then you say to yourself, 702, that's Nevada.
That means my phone call made it all the way out to Nevada and got intercepted there and was sent back.
Uh-huh.
So you're able to sometimes figure things out by using those codes.
Uh-huh.
So what exactly does the 1T stand for, though?
You know, I used to know that.
It's the particular office that the recording is emanating from, the particular location.
I see.
I could probably, you know, look that up and find out exactly where that's coming from,
you know, the address and everything of where it's coming from.
But to most people, that wouldn't really be of interest anyway.
Oh, well, I was just curious.
Yeah.
Do I win anything?
No, just our respect.
All right, great program.
All right, thanks for calling.
I guess I should have mentioned that we don't give away prizes, but at BAI, that goes without saying.
Good evening.
Good evening.
I'd just like to say, as far as getting 411 for free also, if you're legally blind, you can get 411 or any other information for free.
Good point.
Now, I believe, is that through TDD?
I wouldn't know.
I mean, all I know is I'm signed up with AT&T and New York Tel, and I get the calls for nothing.
Uh-huh.
Actually, that's kind of a silly question because TDD is a teletype service, and, of course, if you're blind, you wouldn't be able to.
Well, you can do it with a computer, but deaf people get a reduced rate because they have to stay on longer to communicate.
I saw a demonstration of a service for the deaf where you call an 800 number and you connect via teletype,
and you literally type in communication with an operator and ask her for the number.
I'm not sure if it's AT&T or New York Telephone.
They have an office near Albany, whereas if you or I wanted to talk to a deaf person,
we call that 800 number, and they connect us to the deaf person, and they act as the go-between,
and we get charged for the call to that deaf person.
We get charged regular rates, but if the deaf person calls us through that service, he gets charged a reduced rate because it's on his line.
I just have a few other questions.
This is really my first time, and I imagine you've been asked this dozens of times before.
I know, for example, if you dial 958, you get your own number played back to you.
Right. I'm told that works in northern New Jersey as well.
9963 gives you a tone. I think it used to give you a deadline.
Over 20 years ago, there used to be a number you could call to make your own phone ring.
It doesn't work anymore, and I don't know any number that does that, but sometimes that comes in handy.
Are there any special numbers you can give where an average consumer might be interested?
Well, as far as just strange noises and things?
Say, to get your own phone to ring.
Well, to get your own—it depends where you are.
In the Bronx.
You're in the Bronx.
So it would probably be through the 660 exchange for you, but that works differently in different areas of the city.
In other parts, usually it's an unused exchange.
I mean, I used to dial 660, wait for a dial tone, and dial 6 and hang up, and the phone would ring.
I don't think that works anymore.
How many digits have you dialed 660 now?
I haven't tried it in years.
In a lot of places, it's 660 plus the last four digits of your phone number.
I see.
And you get a dial tone, you hang up, pick up again and hang up, and it rings.
In other places, it's an exchange similar to 660.
I remember at one point it was 550 in a particular area, but of course 550 was then taken over by the conference calls.
It's an unused exchange in most cases for that particular kind of ringback.
But then there's other ones.
Sometimes there's ringbacks hidden in working exchanges, so you really have to search around for that
and sometimes try to con it out of your local lineman when he comes over to fix your phone.
So one way to get it for sure.
Okay, this is a good way to get it.
If you have some kind of a call recorder like the kind Radio Shack used to sell,
which I'm really kind of annoyed that they stopped selling, that prints out all the phone numbers that are dialed on your line.
If you have the phone man over and you say, hey, can you make sure my phone is working,
and he'll call the ringback line and have it ring back,
well, your little Radio Shack machine will print out the number he called.
Well, another thing is you can just record what he's doing,
and if you've got good enough ears, you can listen to the tape again.
Yeah, you can decode touch tones assuming you use touch tones.
Yeah, or even if he dials it, you can kind of count the number.
Well, you can't have another phone off the hook if he's dialing it, though.
That's the only problem there.
There is a... I think Radio Shack even makes it.
It's some kind of testing equipment where you can actually record off the line,
and it doesn't look like a pickup.
It can hear the line, but it doesn't look like a pickup.
Uh-huh.
Well, there's all kinds of devices like that,
so if you're really looking for some bit of information, you'll probably find it.
Thanks so much for calling.
Let's see if we can get through a few more phone calls tonight.
Good evening.
Hi, I want to ask about call forwarding.
Yeah.
And if you dial, can you tell that the phone's been call forwarded?
Well, you know, that's a very interesting question
because most cases you cannot.
Well, at least you should not be able to, but in some cases you can.
Right, I've experienced that.
And my other part of the question is if I call, let's say, within 212,
and somebody's got a call forwarded to California,
do I pay the cost to go to California, or do I pay within the number?
No, they pay for a call from their home phone to California
every time you call their home phone.
You only pay for a call to their home phone.
Right.
But I've noticed sometimes you call and there's, like, a short ring,
and then you hear a different ring, and that's usually a call forwarding.
I was wondering if that's true.
Well, that sounds like a customer-installed call forwarding device
that simply takes a phone, picks it up,
transfers it to another line, and makes a call on that line.
Sometimes you have crude instruments that do that.
But phone company call forwarding is supposed to work seamlessly.
But what happens, especially with the DMS-100 switch,
is that sometimes you'll get either inordinately long pauses
that tells you that something strange is going on,
or you'll even hear the MF tones that tell you what phone number
it's being forwarded to.
So you'll call somebody, and you'll hear, you know,
after about the right amount of time that it should start ringing,
you'll suddenly hear this burst of MF tones,
multi-frequency tones, not touch tones,
but those ones you hear sometimes on long-distance calls.
And if you're able to translate those,
you'll figure out what line it's being forwarded to, which is absurd.
There's no reason for that to be revealed at all.
Right.
So beware of that.
Thanks a lot.
Okay, thanks for calling.
We have a couple more phone calls I'm going to try to get to.
Good evening.
Anybody there?
Hello?
Yeah, go ahead.
Oh, good.
Yes.
I had, like...
Turn down your radio.
Okay.
My problem is this.
I had two questions.
What would the purpose of a beeper be that you can't input anything into?
I mean, how does that happen?
Very good question.
The old beepers, beepers of old, were all like that,
where you could only call it and beep somebody,
and only one person would ever be beeping you.
For instance, a doctor would only be beeped by his office,
so there would be no reason for him to enter a phone number.
It's for circumstances like that where either one person has that number
or you can only be beeped by one particular circumstance.
Gotcha.
That's interesting.
All right, that makes sense.
And my other point, another one I had is that my past couple phone bills,
just thought it might be of interest.
The last two calls have been, like, to these faraway places
that I don't even know where they are.
And it's been the last two calls on the past two bills.
And, of course, they promise.
You mean they show up on your phone bill the same number?
Yeah.
And the same, like, last two days of each bill.
Really?
Yeah, it's interesting.
Knowing you're interested in these matters.
How long are the calls for?
Oh, serious money, double digits.
But how much time is spent on the calls?
Close to an hour on one.
Really?
And how far away is this?
Somewhere in the direction of the Caribbean, I guess.
Really?
Now, you have full access to your line?
You know that that's not made on your premises anywhere?
Yes.
Well, I would definitely suspect that somebody somehow
is tapping into your line at some point.
It's interesting.
And, I mean, in the past there's been some random things, you know,
like a few of these calls, and then they just, you know,
that 611, you call for a check or some kind of nonsense,
they were supposed to come and check the line or do some kind of thing
to see if it wasn't a cross, whatever.
But now they're, you know, they're insisting they haven't.
Well, if it's large fraud like you described,
it's likely that somebody is doing it intentionally.
And the fact that it shows up at the end of every month,
maybe they're timing it, but they're timing it wrong
because it should show up at the beginning of the month
so they can get the maximum amount of time before you notice it.
But by no means pay for those calls.
They're conciliatory on that point, although they don't absolutely swear.
I mean, technically I think that they, I don't know what they're legal.
Well, again, one of those devices would certainly help you out
if they still made them at Radio Shack.
It would tell you when your phone was in use.
But for now, perhaps you can get a telephone that lights up
when someone picks up an extension,
and then you can catch these people red-handed.
Oh, that's thoughtful, too. That's wonderful.
All right. Well, good luck on that.
We're going to try to take a couple more phone calls.
Yeah, people can always tap into your line at some point.
The question is who's doing it and from where.
Good evening.
Hello.
Go ahead.
Bicycle messengers also use the beepers that can't have input.
Uh-huh.
It's only the office calling to give you a new assignment.
Yeah, I understand gangs use them, too,
to notify everybody to show up at a certain point.
I would think they have the higher-tech ones
that's used in various trafficking and so on.
Yeah.
I wanted to ask you about personal communication networks
or the idea that you have a phone number instead of a phone.
Uh-huh.
Do you know what I'm talking about?
Vaguely.
That's something that's starting to rear its head.
You mean where basically we have a number
and we're at that number 24 hours a day no matter where we go.
Right.
The nearest phone gets that call
because we're also being tracked by satellite or something.
Yeah, it's sort of like having a cellular phone implanted into you.
Yeah, in the times we can review on Sunday.
It shook me up a little.
Yeah, it shakes me up quite a bit
because I see some advantages to such technology.
I also see a lot of possible consequences
that can really be harmful to people's privacy,
especially if we get used to that kind of thing.
But unfortunately, we don't have enough time
to even scratch the surface of that.
But that's a great topic for a future show.
Okay, I just wanted to say one other thing.
Yes.
Earlier you had two examples of the reading of a number.
The number blah, blah, blah is not in service.
Right.
The second one you said sounded particularly like it was lost in space.
Yeah.
I think what was going on there years ago,
like maybe 15 years ago,
I read an article in The Times
about a woman whose voice is actually used for these recordings.
Uh-huh.
She said that each number, each digit, is recorded seven times.
There's seven versions of it, depending on where it falls in the thing,
so that you have the cadence of the reading of a number.
Seven, seven, seven.
Uh-huh.
If all of the sevens are alike, if each digit is alike,
it sounded like the second call that you had.
Yeah.
It was each digit was simply recorded once and stuck in wherever,
which is why it sounded so alien.
No falling intonation, yes.
That's probably what happened.
No difference in the intonation,
so it sounded like somebody from another planet.
Yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thanks very much.
One more call, and then we're out of here.
Good morning.
Good evening, rather.
I'm sorry.
Hi, Emanuel.
How are you doing?
Based on some of your previous programs,
I had subscribed to cable and wireless,
which has some very interesting features,
but the one I wanted to mention to you that you had not mentioned
is that by using their local calling option,
the 950 number,
Yeah.
it seems to me quite possible to take myself completely out of the 9X system.
That's quite true.
If you make all your calls using the 950 service, yes.
I don't know if you would save money making all your calls that way.
For instance, if you called, you know, your next-door neighbor,
I think it would undoubtedly be cheaper to use 9X for that,
especially if it's a long call, but not significantly,
especially at night.
They also offer discounts on selected numbers,
cable and wireless does,
and it just seems that as a possible kind,
I mean, I don't like 9X.
I would even pay more to avoid them.
Lots of people have that feeling towards them.
An interesting method of protest of a large number of people began to do such things.
Listen, we have about 10 seconds.
Any final comments?
Well, just thank you for your show.
Okay.
Thanks very much for calling.
At least one happy person that has discovered the joys of 950 numbers,
which is something that we've talked about in the past
and hopefully we'll talk about in the future.
It's time for us to get out of here,
so we're going to get out of here,
make room for the personal computer show.
Program has been off the hook.
This is Emanuel Goldstein.
I'll be back again at some point during the marathon,
begging for money and things like that.
Stay tuned.
We'll be in touch.
This is WBAI New York.
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The night of Friday, January the 10th, 3 a.m.
Into the morning...