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For Aura Bugato, I'm Dan Fritz.

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Hi, I'm Scott Elliott. I'm the director of Three Penny Opera. Come check it out and keep listening to WBAI New York.

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Instead of, instead of, staying home in bed at night behaving.

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They want love, they want love.

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Chasing up the alley with the sentimental craving.

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I love WBAI.

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And

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We need a lot more of that, that's for sure. You're listening to WBAI in New York. The time is seven o'clock.

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It's a Wednesday night, and that means you have no choice but to sit back and listen to Off The Hook.

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We couldn't get much worse.

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But if they could, they would.

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Bondedly bond for the best.

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Expect the worst.

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I hope that's understood.

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Bondedly bond.

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And a good evening to everybody. The program is Off The Hook. Emmanuel Goldstein here with you for the next hour.

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Talking about all kinds of technological issues and freedom of speech and computers and telephones and whatnot.

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With us tonight, over there is Jim.

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Bonsoir.

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And Mike.

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Hi.

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Arseny.

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Hi.

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Redhacked.

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Hello.

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Walter.

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Hey.

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Greetings from Philadelphia. Red Bird is airborne right now.

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How would you know that?

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Because I met up with him here in Philadelphia before he got on his flight to L.A.

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I taught him that trick, to go to Philadelphia to get the cheaper flights. Now he does it all the time.

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He saves a lot of money, thanks to you, Emmanuel.

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All right, well, at least now he's doing it on his own.

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Okay, we have an action-packed show tonight.

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First, a couple of announcements.

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The Hope Conference draws ever closer, July 21st, 22nd, 23rd.

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With our trio of keynotes, Richard Stallman and Michael Hart, Angelo Biafra, along with Kevin Mitnick, FiberOptic.

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Yeah, remember him? He's going to be there.

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And a whole bunch of other people working on the schedule for the last week, nonstop.

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And we have something like 80 talks.

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All kinds of films we're going to be showing, all kinds of presentations, artwork, things like that.

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But pre-registration is closing. Pre-registration is closing soon.

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Bernie, are you on a highway or something?

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Actually, I'm walking on the street, but I'll be in a quiet area in about two minutes.

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All right, well, we'll turn down some...

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I'll keep my finger over the microphone.

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Would you please? Thank you.

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Pre-registration closes, for those of you overseas, this Friday, June 30th.

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And for those of you not overseas, that is those of you in the U.S. or Canada, July 10th is the cutoff date.

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That's a Monday.

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The cost will go up at the door.

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We don't like to mention prices on the air, but we will say it's going to be an extra $15.

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If we're not mentioning a price, we'll be doing it that way.

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You could have mentioned a percentage.

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Yeah, I didn't have time to figure that out.

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It goes from, what, 100% to 125% of the early price, doesn't it?

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Yeah, I guess that works.

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But here's the interesting thing. You know what? We're going to be taking euros in addition to dollars.

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What will we do with them?

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Well, you see, lots of people come to this country and then they complain about getting ripped off at the banks when they do the exchange thing.

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This way, we're the ones who get ripped off at the banks.

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We'll do it all in one big sum.

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So maybe we won't get ripped off quite as badly.

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We'll have to figure out how many euros equal how many dollars at registration and things like that.

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But it's just one way of making things easier for those of you coming from overseas.

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Will you take Canadian dollars?

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Let's not get crazy here.

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It will definitely be under 1,000 euros. We know that much.

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A lot easier for Canadians to get American dollars quickly than it is for Europeans with landing at the airport and coming by a taxi or whatever.

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It can be frenzied.

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Don't Canadians land at airports?

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Not always.

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It's getting too crazy now because then we're going to have to take Brazilian money and who knows what else.

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The euro is a nice big currency that many, many countries use, and that's why.

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They're not that big.

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Okay, you know what? No euros then. How about that?

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You see how these things go?

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You offer one thing.

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It's like offering the formats.

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We offer MP3 and then people want Og Vorbis, and if you offer Og Vorbis, someone's going to complain about that and want something else, and it never ends.

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Never.

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Right, Mike?

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Why don't we have Og Vorbis?

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All right.

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That's now your job.

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Send your euros so we can afford to put the format in Og Vorbis.

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And we're also going to take credit cards at the door.

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But not give them back.

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I don't want to hear any of these jokes about hackers and credit cards because we have the most trustworthy people imaginable

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and the people who understand security better than anybody else.

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You're a lot safer doing a credit card transaction with us than with a store.

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I'll tell you that right now.

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Yes, Bernie?

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I was just going to say that if Jim mentioned the percentage of price increase for on-site registration versus registering now online,

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our clever listeners could actually deduce with that number and the one you announced the actual ticket price.

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Our clever listeners can deduce it by going to www.hope.net and find out everything right there.

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See, I thought they were clever enough to deduce it without being told that they were clever enough to deduce it.

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Speaking of clever people who deduce things, we had a winner for last week's contest.

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Mike, do you want to give us some details on this?

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Yes, it's true.

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We had a winner very quickly, I think less than a day after we announced it on the air.

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I was flabbergasted.

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You thought no one was ever going to get it.

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No, you explained it to me and I still didn't get it.

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Yes, but now if people want to know how to get it, they can go on the website and click over to the blog, the Hope blog,

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and it will explain in great detail how to decode the message.

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Well, I'd like for you to just give us a brief explanation only because for the humor factor

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because what we basically had was we had a phone number that you devised.

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It was an imitation of the other phone numbers with the weird number messages.

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Which just for the record, I did not devise.

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No, those ones had nothing to do with us even though a listener accused us of doing it.

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And if we did, then no one's admitted it yet.

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I know I didn't do it.

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I'm really the only person I can speak for.

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But the one you devised started off the same way.

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It said, what was it again, group 215?

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Well, it played the clip of the song and then it said group 215, group 215.

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And then it read off a series of numbers in groups of five over and over again, well, twice each time until it got to the end.

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Now, okay, we can't figure out what the other ones mean.

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What did this one mean and how are we able to get to it?

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Well, this one said, mind frown line for hope tickets, please email, and it gave an email address.

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That was the actual message to decode, not the message in the Craigslist ad that drew people's attention to the number.

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Right. Well, I wouldn't give out the answer in the question.

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Yeah, that wouldn't make any sense.

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Okay, so in order for people to get to that phrase, they had to do something wacky to the numbers.

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Right, well, first you had to take the groups of five and divide them up into groups of three instead.

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And how would you know to do that?

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Well, we've discussed it on the show.

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Okay, and there are zeros pretty much separating almost all the numbers.

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Yeah, except towards the end.

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And the thing you might notice is that the numbers, not sort of monotonically increasing, but they tended to get larger towards the end.

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So you might notice that, and through some cleverness, you could find out that at the beginning, the first three-digit number,

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A is zero and B is one and so on up to whatever it was for M, which was the first letter.

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And then the alphabet sort of increases by two and then by one, but you skip the five.

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The clue we gave was lose the five, right?

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So that was the group two and five, you use the two and the one, but you don't use the five.

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Yes, and I guess I can admit now on the air that this is due to a programming bug.

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I intended to use the five.

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Okay, but we just said lose the five.

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It's easier than just doing it all over again.

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Okay, so a number of people were discussing this.

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I know homelandstupidity.us had a big discussion about it.

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And I guess you can probably hear the number over there as well if you really want to go through this yourself and figure it out.

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But congratulations to the person who did win.

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And keep looking for other HOPE contests.

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Look for the flashing George W. Bush icon behind the HOPE logo on the 2600.com webpage.

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So okay, yeah, that was a bit of fun.

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Something else that's fun, my postcard arrived.

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I sent myself a postcard from Cuba.

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It arrived two days ago.

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This got sent, what, the first week of May?

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Something like that.

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Yeah, and here it is, late June, and the thing finally arrived.

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As everybody else has remarked, there is no postmark on the stamp.

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The postnet barcode was covered up by tape or something.

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I'm not quite sure why that is.

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I don't think other people had that happen.

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Well, that was added by the United States.

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I've seen that happen in all sorts of mail.

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I don't think that there's anything to be inferred by the tape or lack of markings on it.

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Usually they print a new barcode on the tape.

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All right, forget about the tape, but how about no postmark on the stamp?

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That is odd.

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And every single postcard from Cuba has no postmark on the stamp.

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Really? That is definitely odd.

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We've now established that.

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Now, I'm trying to figure out how the mail actually gets here from there

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because obviously it's not done through conventional means,

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and I don't think we're able to just simply trade mail

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because then we'd be doing business with them, and we're not allowed to do that.

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So I think it's going in somebody's bag or something,

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and when they get around to it, they just drop it off in the States

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because almost two months for it to get 80 miles to the States?

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I don't know about that.

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I mean, if it was a Cuban diplomat to the UN mailing it,

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it would be kind of odd to accept mail with a Cuban stamp somewhere in New York around the UN.

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I'm thinking it's some secret agreement probably with the Canadians

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whereby it goes by diplomatic pouch to Canada.

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It's handed over to somebody in Canada.

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It goes by some sort of, maybe not diplomatic pouch,

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but some sort of not quite mail channels to the U.S. mail.

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Well, I mean, they could just mail it all to Canada and have somebody,

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but then it would get stamped somewhere.

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Right. You'd have Canadian stamps.

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You'd need Canadian stamps.

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It's all very mysterious.

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What's that?

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It's all very mysterious.

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It is mysterious.

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If anybody can shed some light on this, please email us, oth at 2600.com.

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We'd sure love to know.

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If you are in the Canadian post office or have relatives who are,

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inquire there because that's where we think it's most suspicious.

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What do you think?

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Okay, okay.

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I don't necessarily think.

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If someone else here comes up with an alternative theory, we can appeal.

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Could be Mexico.

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Could be the Bahamas.

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Yeah, it could be anywhere.

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I like Canada.

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Could be Europe.

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Perhaps if it comes straight to the United States,

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there's no postmarks because the U.S. refuses to acknowledge their existence.

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Oh, maybe something like that.

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Well, if you're in a post office in Miami or something like that

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and you get mail from Cuba and you're told not to do anything to it,

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I have read that it takes a whole month for mail to get from Cuba to Santiago,

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from Havana to Santiago, which is the second largest city.

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So maybe the Cuban Postal Administration is just incompetent.

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Can we send mail to Cuba?

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I imagine so.

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Who are we going to send mail to?

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Bernie, we can send mail to your friend.

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Bernie?

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Bernie's in shock.

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But I think Bernie has sent mail to Radio Havana.

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No, he said he'd be in a quiet place.

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I just didn't know it was going to be this quiet.

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Okay, well, maybe Bernie just has drifted away for a second.

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We'll check back with him in a minute.

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If he's still not there, we'll have to call him again.

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Here's an interesting story.

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A hacker broke into the Agriculture Department's computer system

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and may have obtained names, Social Security numbers,

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and photos of 26,000 Washington area employees and contractors.

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That's according to the Agriculture Department who said this last week.

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Agriculture Secretary Mike Johans said the department will provide

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free credit monitoring for one year for anyone who might have been affected.

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It's that same scam where they basically say,

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hey, you can have this for a year, and if you don't tell us anything,

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we're just going to sign you up for it afterwards.

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It's amazing how that works almost anywhere.

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The break-in happened during the first weekend in June.

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The technology staff learned of the breach on June 5th

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and informed them the following day

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but believed personal information was protected by security software.

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Again, it's all very vague and nebulous.

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But people who believe they may be affected by the data breach

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can go to www.firstgov.gov for more information.

241
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The Agriculture Department has a toll-free number to call for information

242
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:11,000
about the incident or about consumer identity protections.

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The number 1-800-FEDINFO is a call center that operates from 8 a.m. to 9 p.m.

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Monday through Saturday.

245
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Let's give them a call.

246
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Yes, go ahead.

247
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I had a quick question.

248
00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,000
Oh, that's Bernie. He's gone.

249
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When people are actually victims of identity theft

250
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,000
with their Social Security number and all that,

251
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is the Social Security Administration dishing out new numbers all the time?

252
00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:32,000
That's a good question.

253
00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:33,000
How does that work?

254
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:36,000
It's very difficult to get a new number through Social Security.

255
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:40,000
Usually you have to say that the number 666 is on my Social Security number.

256
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I want a different number.

257
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Otherwise, it's very difficult.

258
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They don't do it for cases of identity theft or identity co-mingling

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unless you can show that it's really serious.

260
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Okay, let's get a dial tone here and give a call to the FEDINFO number.

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00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:05,000
I don't know if there's going to be a person here or a machine or what.

262
00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:09,000
Welcome to 1-800-FEDINFO.

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If you are calling about the recent theft of Veterans Affairs electronic data,

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00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,000
we believe this theft was a random act

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and not a deliberate attempt to steal information about veterans.

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The VA is actively investigating,

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but there is no reason to believe any veterans information will be misused.

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00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:31,000
We do not have information about individual records that may have been stolen,

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but we'll provide updates as information becomes available on www.firstgov.gov.

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Said that already.

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That's F-I-R-S-T-G-O-V dot G-O-V.

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00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:50,000
If you would still like to speak to an agent about this incident,

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00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,000
please press 0 now.

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00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:58,000
If you are calling regarding the possible USDA personal information breach

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00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,000
or have other government questions,

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00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:03,000
please stay on the line for additional options.

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To continue in English, please press 1.

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00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,000
To continue in Spanish, please press 2.

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00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:15,000
Thank you for calling 1-800-FEDINFO,

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00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:18,000
the gateway to information about the federal government.

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00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:26,000
If you have Internet access, we invite you to visit www.firstgov.gov.

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00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:31,000
If your call is in regards to the possible USDA personal information breach,

283
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:33,000
you may press 0 now.

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00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:38,000
Your call may be monitored or recorded for training and quality assurance purposes.

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00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:42,000
For passport or visa information, please press 1.

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00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:47,000
For general information on government funding, such as grants, please press 2.

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00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:51,000
For information on federal jobs, please press 3.

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00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:55,000
For information about Social Security, please press 4.

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00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:59,000
If you have a document that needs to be authenticated, please press 5.

290
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:04,000
For information about Medicare, Medicaid, birth certificates, taxes,

291
00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:08,000
veterans' benefits, identity theft, or work-related issues,

292
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,000
please press 6.

293
00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,000
For all other questions, please press 0

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00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,000
to speak with a customer service representative.

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I'm sorry, our system did not recognize your choice.

296
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,000
Please re-enter your selection.

297
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,000
Yeah, that's the story of my life.

298
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,000
Okay, those are the folks at FedInfo there.

299
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:32,000
Wait, so there's two thefts of personal data that they're telling you about.

300
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Were there two, or did they just repeat themselves?

301
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:37,000
No, there's the Veterans Affairs and the USDA.

302
00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,000
I'll bet those people are getting an offer of a year of credit monitoring.

303
00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:47,000
They gave the veterans, the 26 million veterans whose information was on a laptop

304
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:52,000
after somebody illegally took the information home to work on it at home,

305
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:56,000
they gave each of them, after much to do, a year's worth of credit protection,

306
00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:03,000
which, as you say, will become an offer to pay for it afterwards.

307
00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,000
Why is it always 26, 26 million, 26,000?

308
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:07,000
Yeah, I noticed that too.

309
00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:11,000
It's a subtle way of getting us, but we're not going to react to it, all right?

310
00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:12,000
We're not going to react.

311
00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:14,000
We're not going to be goaded into anything like that.

312
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:18,000
Why aren't these organizations liable for loss of any of this information?

313
00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:22,000
What kind of recourse does a person have if their identity has been stolen and used?

314
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:23,000
It's the Feds.

315
00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:24,000
They have sovereignty.

316
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:29,000
Even like private companies, do you have any kind of way to deal with that?

317
00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:30,000
Bernie is back, I believe.

318
00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,000
Do you have an answer for this, Bernie?

319
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:38,000
Well, unfortunately, if you peel back the skins on an onion around the federal government,

320
00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:44,000
you'll find that they have virtual immunity to lawsuits for this kind of stuff.

321
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:50,000
I would say that they lied on that message you just got through that voice response system

322
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:54,000
and they said no information about the data that was lost.

323
00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:57,000
Clearly, they have information about the data that was lost.

324
00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:58,000
Of course.

325
00:17:58,000 --> 00:17:59,000
They just lied.

326
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,000
I mean, how would they know that data was lost if they didn't have information on it?

327
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:03,000
Exactly.

328
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:07,000
And they say, well, we don't believe that's going to be used in a bad way.

329
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:08,000
How do you know that too?

330
00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:09,000
How do you know how it's going to be used?

331
00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:15,000
I think they just messed up somehow and something got lost.

332
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,000
And they're just trying to mollify people right now.

333
00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,000
Yeah, mollify people.

334
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:20,000
Okay.

335
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:24,000
Now, we have a very interesting story that you may have heard about in the mass media

336
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:28,000
because it involves the mass media actually, and that is the New York Times story,

337
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,000
which came out on June 22nd, begins this way.

338
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Under a secret Bush administration program,

339
00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,000
we're going to have to start coming up with letters and numbers

340
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:40,000
for all the secret Bush administration programs there are.

341
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,000
This was initiated weeks after 9-11.

342
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Counterterrorism officials have gained access to financial records

343
00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,000
from a vast international database

344
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and examined banking transactions involving thousands of Americans

345
00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:54,000
and others in the United States.

346
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That's according to government and industry officials.

347
00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,000
Now, that's how the story started, and it went on for quite a bit,

348
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:06,000
and it has provoked the most vicious attacks that I have seen in a long time

349
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against the media in general, and it's kind of frightening.

350
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,000
It's kind of frightening.

351
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:12,000
It's frightening.

352
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:16,000
So Bush speaking against this, calling it disgrace.

353
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:17,000
I think they're using the word disgraceful.

354
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:18,000
Everyone's calling it disgraceful.

355
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:19,000
You need to clarify.

356
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:24,000
Bush would not do anything so useful as call the program itself a disgrace.

357
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:25,000
Oh, no, no, no.

358
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It's his program.

359
00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,000
I don't think he's that inept.

360
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:33,000
But the fact at the time, I saw this on CNN last week when the story broke,

361
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:37,000
that there are radio talk show hosts all over the country who are outraged,

362
00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,000
outraged not at Bush.

363
00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:42,000
They're outraged at the New York Times for putting us at jeopardy

364
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by revealing this information.

365
00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:47,000
And you have jokers like Representative Peter King.

366
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I talked about him on my other show yesterday,

367
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:54,000
actually calling for journalists to be shot for treason.

368
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This he said about a year ago.

369
00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:00,000
But this is the mentality that's starting to take over where people are

370
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:05,000
successfully getting the public to believe that revealing this information

371
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,000
that are very likely completely 100% illegal,

372
00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:11,000
somehow that is wrong to reveal it.

373
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:16,000
There was talk about how the media was disgraceful in revealing the fact that

374
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the administration leaked a CIA person's name,

375
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,000
not the fact that the administration leaked the name,

376
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,000
the fact that the media reported that the administration leaked the name.

377
00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:26,000
That was disgraceful.

378
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:30,000
It's simply amazing to me that they're going down this road.

379
00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:31,000
But it's scary.

380
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:34,000
It's scary for all of us who have any interest in journalism, media,

381
00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:36,000
what have you.

382
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:39,000
And I think everyone needs to take a good look at this,

383
00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,000
see how the New York Times is being attacked for this.

384
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:43,000
It's frightening.

385
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,000
If I recall correctly from that article,

386
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,000
the database is called, I believe, SWIFT.

387
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:48,000
Yes.

388
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:49,000
And it's in Belgium.

389
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:50,000
Is it in Belgium?

390
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,000
Somewhere around there.

391
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,000
A Belgian cooperative that wraps about $6 trillion daily between banks,

392
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,000
brokerages, stock exchanges.

393
00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:01,000
Do you remember the classic Sunday morning service I gave at The Second Hope

394
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:03,000
under my previous nom de guerre,

395
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:08,000
Red Balaclava about the mark of the beast and the apocalypse

396
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,000
and how the New World Order would be monitoring you?

397
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:12,000
Oh, boy.

398
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:13,000
Okay.

399
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:14,000
But the point is this.

400
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:18,000
Doing what little research I did for that,

401
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,000
I was laughing all the way through the New York Times story.

402
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:26,000
Any apocalyptic account from the time that SWIFT was set up in the late 60s

403
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,000
blames SWIFT as the beast.

404
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,000
It is the thing that measures everything about everybody.

405
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,000
It knows your bank records, okay?

406
00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:40,000
And Bush is going on about how this was a secret and no one knew about it.

407
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:43,000
I'm reading the Times article and this is 20-year-old news to me.

408
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,000
Twenty years old.

409
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:48,000
I'm laughing hysterically while I'm reading it because of this.

410
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:52,000
And I just simply cannot believe it.

411
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,000
U.S. Senator Jim Bunning accused the New York Times of treason yesterday,

412
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,000
suggested the federal government consider bringing criminal charges

413
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,000
against the newspaper for revealing the government program

414
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:06,000
that secretly tracks the financial transactions of suspected terrorists

415
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,000
and a whole lot of Americans, too.

416
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,000
Bunning said the newspaper's revelation of the program

417
00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:14,000
in a story published last week amounted to giving aid and comfort to the enemy.

418
00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:16,000
It is an act of treason.

419
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,000
I think it is up to the attorney general to empanel a grand jury

420
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,000
and bring those people before the grand jury.

421
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:25,000
And if the grand jury feels like that is a violation, they should indict them.

422
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:30,000
And U.S. Representative Peter King, Republican right here in New York

423
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:32,000
and chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee,

424
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,000
said he intends to write Attorney General Alberto Gonzalez

425
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:39,000
and ask that the Times be investigated and prosecuted for publishing the story.

426
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:42,000
That is, as soon as he learns how to write.

427
00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:44,000
All right. Yes, Bernie.

428
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:49,000
This is really not much different what the U.S. government is doing in Belgium

429
00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:52,000
with that database than they have been doing for years here in the U.S.

430
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:56,000
with a branch of the government called FinCEN,

431
00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:00,000
the Financial Crimes Enforcement Board, which is based in Johnstown, Pennsylvania.

432
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,000
It's a very large government intelligence organization

433
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:10,000
that takes data from all U.S. banks and analyzes any kind of funds transfers.

434
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,000
And they've been doing that.

435
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:16,000
That was started under the excuse that it was to help fight the war on drugs,

436
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,000
but they haven't gone away, and FinCEN is still alive and well

437
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,000
and has had increased funding since 9-11.

438
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,000
We don't hear much about it.

439
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:28,000
But it sounds like what they're doing with the SWIFT database in Belgium

440
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:34,000
is not unlike what the U.S. government has been doing to us here at home with FinCEN.

441
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:38,000
The thing that really worries me about this whole thing, the way it's playing out,

442
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,000
what if it was not the New York Times that revealed this?

443
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:45,000
What if it was something much, much smaller, like Cryptome or even Off the Hook,

444
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:49,000
revealing the existence of a program like this, a secret program?

445
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,000
I don't think we'd have the means of defending ourselves

446
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:57,000
quite like something as big as The Times or The Washington Post or the L.A. Times can do.

447
00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,000
So eventually something like this is going to happen

448
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:05,000
where a journalist is successfully accused of treason simply for reporting news.

449
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,000
Does anybody think this is something that should not have been reported?

450
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:15,000
It's noteworthy that The New York Times actually knew about this for quite a while

451
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:21,000
and really took the time to deliberate amongst themselves with editors and so forth

452
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:26,000
as to whether this truly damaged national security to release this information.

453
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:28,000
And they've thought long and hard about it.

454
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:32,000
This isn't like President Bush earlier this week

455
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,000
lit into The Times specifically for releasing this information,

456
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,000
which was leaked by a government agent anyway, obviously.

457
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:47,000
So this was something that the press deeply considered

458
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:52,000
as to whether this was newsworthy and in the public interest.

459
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,000
And I think it is in the public interest.

460
00:24:55,000 --> 00:25:00,000
Well, again, if the news is out there, if people are talking about this,

461
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,000
then I don't think you have to think very long.

462
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,000
Is this going to hurt the national interest?

463
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,000
Because it's already out there.

464
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:08,000
They're reporting news.

465
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:11,000
They're reporting something that is being disseminated.

466
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,000
So obviously that's not even a concern.

467
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:19,000
But what is being used here in this case is the fact that traditionally

468
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:25,000
the media has agreed to demands from the government in times of war.

469
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,000
Except now we're in a state of perpetual war.

470
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,000
This war is never going to end.

471
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:34,000
So we have to always listen to what we are told and not reveal information

472
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,000
that may not seem like it threatens national security,

473
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,000
but because we're told it does and we can't be told why

474
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,000
because knowing why would also hurt national security.

475
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,000
We must just simply do what we're told by the government.

476
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:47,000
What does that sound like?

477
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,000
That doesn't sound like the country that I was born into.

478
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:55,000
One thing that's interesting here is that since SWIFT is a Belgian entity,

479
00:25:55,000 --> 00:26:00,000
they are subject, of course, to Belgian law including Belgian privacy protections.

480
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,000
So there may actually be some consequences for them

481
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:09,000
unlike a lot of the U.S. companies who have been implicated in these sorts of things

482
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:12,000
and at least so far have got away with it.

483
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:18,000
It's fascinating for me to hear these politicians claiming

484
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,000
the New York Times has a far-left agenda.

485
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,000
I don't know where that puts me because I think they're rightist, to be honest,

486
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,000
compared to most of the people I talked about.

487
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,000
Whether or not you think they're to the right or to the left,

488
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,000
I think this is a time to speak up in their defense

489
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:38,000
because this kind of thing, if they are successfully prosecuted for this

490
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,000
or if this kind of thing is stopped in the future

491
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,000
and the next story that comes along is imprinted, we all lose.

492
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:47,000
We all lose regardless of what you think of where the New York Times stands.

493
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,000
That's just something I think is very important.

494
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:51,000
And when you have idiots like Peter King going around

495
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:55,000
suggesting that journalists be shot for printing stories,

496
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,000
that changes everything.

497
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:59,000
That changes the whole face of the landscape

498
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,000
because it gets people thinking along those lines.

499
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:03,000
It really does.

500
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,000
Like, yeah, these people are enemies.

501
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:06,000
They're enemy combatants.

502
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,000
Send them to Guantanamo.

503
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,000
Do whatever you have to do to them.

504
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:12,000
It's worth it to protect our national interest.

505
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:14,000
At least we can still burn the flag.

506
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,000
Yeah, because of what? One vote?

507
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,000
Yeah, well.

508
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:20,000
Unbelievable.

509
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,000
Well, it's clearly an intimidation tactic.

510
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,000
I think they're taking a different tack with this leak

511
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:28,000
and they're really trying to intimidate the New York Times

512
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,000
and other papers and anyone else who might want to put information out.

513
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:32,000
And it's going to succeed.

514
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:33,000
It's going to succeed.

515
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:35,000
A lot of newspapers that are not the New York Times

516
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:38,000
will not print this kind of information.

517
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:40,000
Yeah, and you know there are dozens of other programs

518
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:42,000
which have not been revealed yet.

519
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,000
And if anybody reveals them to us, we will talk about them on the air.

520
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:50,000
We will risk whatever penalties are thrown our way or condemnation.

521
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:53,000
Now, Mike, you had something from the New York Post of all places.

522
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,000
Yeah, I was just walking by the New York Post.

523
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:57,000
Yeah, sure.

524
00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:58,000
You pick it up every day.

525
00:27:58,000 --> 00:27:59,000
Why don't you just confess?

526
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,000
You and Jim are the two New York Post readers in the room.

527
00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:02,000
We all know that.

528
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,000
But we do do it for the gossip.

529
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:06,000
And on the cover of the New York Post, it said,

530
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:10,000
New York crimes in the New York Times font.

531
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:11,000
They use their font?

532
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:12,000
That could be illegal right there.

533
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:13,000
Anything could be illegal.

534
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:14,000
Yeah, because that's their font.

535
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:15,000
They can't use their font.

536
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,000
So my theory is that the Post is really just jealous

537
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,000
that the Times got the story first.

538
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,000
Yeah, like the New York Post would print anything against the Bush regime.

539
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:25,000
Yeah.

540
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,000
Well, hopefully.

541
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:30,000
I think they're certainly happy to do anything

542
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:33,000
that makes the New York Times, in their opinion, look bad.

543
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:37,000
I think it's pure competition more than anything else.

544
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,000
Okay.

545
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:40,000
Another story here.

546
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,000
AT&T has issued an updated privacy policy that took effect last Friday.

547
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:48,000
The changes are significant because they appear to give the telecom giant

548
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,000
more latitude when it comes to sharing customers' personal data

549
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,000
with government officials.

550
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:57,000
The new policy says that AT&T, not customers,

551
00:28:57,000 --> 00:29:00,000
owns customers' confidential information

552
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:03,000
and can use it to protect its legitimate business interests,

553
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,000
safeguard others, or respond to legal process.

554
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:09,000
The policy also indicates that AT&T will track the viewing habits

555
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,000
of customers of its new video service,

556
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,000
something that cable and satellite providers are prohibited from doing.

557
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:19,000
Moreover, AT&T and the SBC that it swallowed up

558
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:23,000
is requiring customers to agree to its updated privacy policy

559
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,000
as a condition for service,

560
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,000
a new move that legal experts say will reduce customers' recourse

561
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:33,000
for any future data sharing with government authorities or others.

562
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,000
It's pretty incredible.

563
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,000
Are there any AT&T users here for cell phone service?

564
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,000
Yeah, although it's part of Singular now.

565
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:42,000
Yeah, that's right.

566
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,000
But Singular might be owned by one of them.

567
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:47,000
It's really confusing.

568
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:50,000
Bernie, this is where the common argument

569
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,000
by a lot of these free market types

570
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:57,000
where if you don't like it, just go to another carrier falls down

571
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:00,000
because there is no competition in a lot of markets,

572
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,000
and people have to agree to this

573
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:07,000
because they don't have all these options to just go somewhere else.

574
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:11,000
Bernie, how does this compare to Sprint PCS, who you're still tied to?

575
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:16,000
I haven't received a notice yet from Sprint PCS in my bill,

576
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:20,000
like AT&T will apparently be notifying its customers,

577
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,000
if it hasn't already, about this.

578
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,000
But you can bet that they're going to follow suit.

579
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:29,000
And as Mike just said, you're not going to have a market choice

580
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:32,000
when it comes to privacy in the near future.

581
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:36,000
So I agree with him that you can't just say,

582
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,000
if you don't like it, just choose another company,

583
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,000
because there's going to be a handful of these big companies,

584
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:45,000
and none of them are going to deny the government what they ask for,

585
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:49,000
and none of us will have a choice as to which carriers to use for privacy.

586
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:53,000
But none of them would have denied the government access in the past.

587
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,000
The only difference is that the government had to go through channels to do it.

588
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,000
Listen to what the policy says now.

589
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,000
While your account information may be personal to you,

590
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:04,000
these records constitute business records that are owned by AT&T.

591
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,000
As such, AT&T may disclose such records to protect its legitimate business interests,

592
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,000
safeguard others, or respond to legal process.

593
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:14,000
It says the company may disclose your information in response to subpoenas,

594
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,000
court orders, or other legal process,

595
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:22,000
omitting the earlier language about such processes being required and or permitted by law.

596
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:26,000
So that's kind of significant there, don't you think?

597
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:30,000
Well, right now it looks like it goes beyond due process.

598
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,000
And simply now the agreement looks like the contract,

599
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,000
which when you sign a contract with a company,

600
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,000
you think a contract is an agreement between two parties.

601
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:42,000
And these contracts with these companies you sign are very one-sided,

602
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:46,000
and they say we can change our side of the contract any time we feel like.

603
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,000
So I agree with you.

604
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:52,000
It's just you have no protection against it.

605
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:53,000
Okay.

606
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:54,000
Time for some listener mail.

607
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,000
We'll be taking phone calls in just a little bit.

608
00:31:56,000 --> 00:32:00,000
Our email address, oth at 2600.com.

609
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,000
We love to hear from you.

610
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:03,000
Dear Off the Hook,

611
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:08,000
my company issues e-track credit cards to use pre-tax salary for metro cards

612
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:10,000
and commuter railroad tickets.

613
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:14,000
In January, the MTA installed an address verification system in its ticket vending machines.

614
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,000
I think we've all come across these.

615
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,000
It prompts you for your home zip code after you swipe your credit card.

616
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,000
If you enter the wrong zip code, the transaction is denied,

617
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,000
and you're given the unhelpful message,

618
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:27,000
cannot process your request, and the prompt to try again or cancel.

619
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,000
I guess you can stay there forever and just keep going until you get the zip code right.

620
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,000
Anyway, today I tried four times to get a metro card and entered my correct zip code,

621
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,000
but because of some problem with the machine, it kept aborting the transaction.

622
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:42,000
After the fourth try, my account was locked out for three business days.

623
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:43,000
Interesting.

624
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,000
The funny part, which I learned later from the credit card company,

625
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:49,000
was that the MTA charged me for each try.

626
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:54,000
It debited my account by the amounts I had entered for a total of $160.

627
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:56,000
The credit card company assures me the money will be refunded.

628
00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:01,000
A person there said that in January they were getting 25 calls a day about this.

629
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,000
By now, the number has dwindled to three a day.

630
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,000
Some problems cited, other than user error,

631
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:10,000
were the machine timing out before the user had a chance to press the enter key,

632
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,000
which is the pound sign on the keypad,

633
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,000
the switching of the enter and cancel, which is a star key,

634
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,000
and the illegibility of the label on the enter key.

635
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,000
The address verification system is supposed to prevent credit card fraud

636
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,000
and protect customers from having their money stolen,

637
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:27,000
but if the procedure by design debits the account before the verification step,

638
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:28,000
where is the logic?

639
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,000
It only means the MTA might benefit from the theft

640
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,000
rather than the person who stole your card.

641
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:34,000
Signed, Tim.

642
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:35,000
Tim, this is shocking.

643
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:36,000
There's no other word for it.

644
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:37,000
You ever hear anything like this, Jim?

645
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,000
It is not shocking.

646
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:40,000
The MTA does this kind of thing?

647
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:41,000
Oh, yeah.

648
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:42,000
I've worked for them for 20 some odd years.

649
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,000
Of course it's not shocking.

650
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,000
Knowingly, they go out and they...

651
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:51,000
I'm curious as to, with this card provided by your company from a third party,

652
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,000
which zip code were you supposed to enter?

653
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:54,000
Your home zip code?

654
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,000
Your office zip code?

655
00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:59,000
The head office of the company you work for's zip code?

656
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:01,000
Or the credit card company's zip code?

657
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:04,000
No, it's supposed to be the zip code that your bill goes to from that credit card.

658
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:05,000
That's what it is.

659
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:07,000
But apparently the bill goes to the company.

660
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,000
Yeah, that's why he got it wrong, probably,

661
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,000
because he didn't know that zip code.

662
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:12,000
He was entering his zip code.

663
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:13,000
I don't know.

664
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,000
Or maybe the machine was just broken.

665
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:16,000
That's possible.

666
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:20,000
It's bad software design on the part of the MTA, which is nothing new.

667
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:21,000
We've known about that.

668
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,000
It's incredibly bad because the whole purpose of it is to see if you're the right person.

669
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:28,000
If it charges you before it verifies that step, what's the point of it in the first place?

670
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:29,000
It could just be broken.

671
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,000
This may not be the design.

672
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:32,000
Yeah, well, you know, there was one thing.

673
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:36,000
I know some Shell gas stations had this where you would pump the gas,

674
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:39,000
and then instead of when they asked you if you wanted a receipt, it asked yes or no.

675
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,000
If you hit the cancel key instead, it canceled the whole transaction,

676
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:44,000
and you got the gas for free.

677
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:47,000
We reported that in 2600 a couple of years ago, and, boy, did that cause a fuss.

678
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:51,000
I think, I mean, I've had times where I've entered the zip code wrong,

679
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:53,000
and I haven't been charged multiple times.

680
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:54,000
Are you sure?

681
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:55,000
Yes.

682
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:58,000
We should go to a subway station after the show,

683
00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:01,000
and let's get you a $500 MetroCard.

684
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:02,000
They don't allow that.

685
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:03,000
Get the zip code, whatever they allow.

686
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:04,000
I don't need it.

687
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,000
It doesn't matter what you need.

688
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:10,000
You need the education, and we'll enter the wrong zip code, and that'll be that.

689
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:11,000
You have nothing to lose.

690
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,000
Nothing to lose, right?

691
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:14,000
You look a little doubtful now.

692
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,000
I don't need a $500 MetroCard.

693
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,000
But you're not going to get one because you're going to enter the zip code wrong.

694
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:20,000
So you're not going to get one, right?

695
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:21,000
Sure.

696
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:22,000
Okay.

697
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:25,000
The trepidation on his face, viewers.

698
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,000
It has to be an amount that he'll have to comment on.

699
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:28,000
$80.

700
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,000
Well, at least they have the verification now,

701
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:33,000
because I did have my credit card stolen once,

702
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:39,000
and they charged my account a couple of unlimited MetroCards right before I left for Europe.

703
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,000
It was a great, great experience.

704
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,000
Okay.

705
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,000
This reader, listener actually, could be a reader too,

706
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:49,000
writes, I accidentally left my BlackBerry turned on while flying recently.

707
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:52,000
Actually, he put the word accidentally in quotes.

708
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,000
So now I suspect it wasn't accidental at all.

709
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:57,000
Don't read his real name then.

710
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:58,000
Oh.

711
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:00,000
It's Dr. Noah Littlepeep again.

712
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:01,000
Who?

713
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:02,000
I don't think that's his real name.

714
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,000
It's from Canada.

715
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,000
He's written to us a couple of times.

716
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,000
It kept the network signal for a surprisingly long time,

717
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,000
and I was able to send and receive email for about two-thirds of the climb to cruising altitude,

718
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,000
but I couldn't get a signal after that.

719
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,000
The signal returned soon after we started descent.

720
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,000
Bernie, does this make sense to you?

721
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:19,000
Yes.

722
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,000
I wonder how close to the window he was holding his BlackBerry.

723
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:27,000
It is intriguing that these low-power handsets, or BlackBerrys,

724
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:34,000
can get a signal several miles airborne to a cell site.

725
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,000
My concern is how many other cell sites he was hitting simultaneously

726
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,000
and what confusion that was causing to the network.

727
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:44,000
Well, obviously it wasn't affecting his connection because he was able to proceed normally.

728
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,000
But it probably caused some consternation at the network switching level

729
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:55,000
because it was receiving his signal equidistant from probably multiple cell sites at the same time,

730
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:58,000
which is never going to happen when you're on the ground.

731
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:03,000
These networks are designed for your radio or BlackBerry or phone to be at ground level,

732
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:05,000
but once you get it way up in the air,

733
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:10,000
you're going to blanket a whole city's worth of cell sites simultaneously with your signal,

734
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:14,000
unlike the cellular model where you're going to be only within one cell on the ground.

735
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:17,000
So it probably caused some network havoc on the ground without knowing it.

736
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:18,000
Right.

737
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:19,000
Here's the thing, though.

738
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:24,000
When he got all the way up to cruising altitude, how come he lost signal there?

739
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:28,000
Probably just the power decreases.

740
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:29,000
It's called the inverse square law.

741
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:38,000
If you get farther away from something, the power received at the other end decreases exponentially.

742
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:42,000
So he probably just got too far away from the receiver to transmit the signal,

743
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:46,000
or he got too far away from the transmitter base station to receive the signal.

744
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,000
One or the other, he was too far away.

745
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:49,000
You're shaking your head, Mike.

746
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:50,000
Do you disagree?

747
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:52,000
It's quadratically, not exponentially.

748
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:53,000
Okay.

749
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:54,000
All right.

750
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:57,000
Thanks for cutting in with that correction there.

751
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:58,000
Interesting.

752
00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:04,000
So I guess if your plane is in distress, you won't be able to phone back to the ground if you're 40,000 feet up in the air.

753
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:07,000
You'll have to use the pay service that they have on the plane itself.

754
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:08,000
Yeah.

755
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:13,000
I don't think the so-called 9-11 cell phone callers were at that high an altitude

756
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:19,000
when they were supposedly making successful cell phone calls to their loved ones in their final hours.

757
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:23,000
That's if you believe that story, and they didn't all land someplace and wind up on another planet.

758
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:25,000
Oh, on the Cuban email manual.

759
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:26,000
Yes.

760
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,000
You can note postcards and mail and so forth.

761
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:31,000
I do have experience with that, as Mike pointed out.

762
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:34,000
I have gotten QSL cards from Radio Havana, Cuba,

763
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:38,000
which are just really nice postcards with a nice theme from Cuba

764
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:43,000
with a friendly thank-you message on the back confirming that I had received a signal of Radio Havana, Cuba,

765
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,000
on 6,000 kilohertz, or 6 megahertz.

766
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:52,000
And I have gotten responses from them much more quickly than you got your postcards to the U.S.,

767
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:56,000
and I actually wonder if their official government mail from Radio Havana, Cuba,

768
00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:02,000
is handled differently than consumer or civilian mail.

769
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,000
Yeah, definitely.

770
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:10,000
If you send a request by U.S. mail to Radio Havana,

771
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,000
you get your QSL card back in about a month.

772
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:22,000
If you send your QSL request or confirmation that you received their signal via email at rhc.cu,

773
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:26,000
you can get a postcard back in about two weeks,

774
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:31,000
which is, what, at least three times faster than you got yours.

775
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:34,000
Well, that's true, but it's only one direction the mail has to go to.

776
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:35,000
Well, I'm talking about email.

777
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:39,000
If you email Radio Havana via rhc.cu,

778
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:42,000
You're not sending them a letter, so it takes a lot quicker.

779
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:46,000
So it looks like you sent your postcard from Cuba to here, correct?

780
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:47,000
Right.

781
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:48,000
And it took, what, six weeks, you said?

782
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,000
Six, seven weeks, yeah.

783
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:53,000
But there were a batch that showed up two weeks ago, too.

784
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:56,000
A lot of them showed up, and then the next batch is now.

785
00:39:56,000 --> 00:40:00,000
I think what he's saying is in both cases, the mail only had to go one way,

786
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:04,000
and with emailing Radio Havana, it took two weeks.

787
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,000
With you sending it from Cuba, it took six, seven weeks.

788
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,000
Well, wait.

789
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:12,000
I thought he said that if you sent them a piece of mail in the U.S. mail,

790
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,000
it took four weeks from that point.

791
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:16,000
U.S. mail has to get there, too, and that takes a long time.

792
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,000
We're just looking at the time difference between getting from Cuba to here.

793
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:23,000
Yeah, but you don't know when the car you sent to Cuba arrived in Cuba, do you?

794
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,000
No, no, no.

795
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:25,000
I said we do it by email.

796
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:28,000
If you do it by email, they get that information right away.

797
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:29,000
There's no delay with them getting there.

798
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:30,000
I know, I know, I understand.

799
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:32,000
That's the point I'm making is that you cut out the time.

800
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,000
I think we are all in agreement, and yet we're arguing in email.

801
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,000
Cut out the time where you sent the mail from the U.S. to Cuba.

802
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:38,000
What's so hard to understand?

803
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,000
I think the point he's trying to make is when he emails them,

804
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,000
they in Cuba send him a postcard.

805
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:45,000
Obviously.

806
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,000
You were in Cuba, and you sent yourself a postcard.

807
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,000
Thus, it took two weeks for them and seven weeks for you.

808
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:53,000
Yeah, but we were comparing the two means of getting a QSL card,

809
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:54,000
not me sending a postcard.

810
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,000
We all know that takes an amazingly long time.

811
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,000
All right, we all understand.

812
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:00,000
I think so.

813
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:04,000
I think Radio Havana Cuba doesn't use the ripoff expensive peso stamps.

814
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:05,000
They use the other peso.

815
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:09,000
Well, whatever they use, it takes a real long time, and they don't postmark it.

816
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:11,000
People will say, you just dropped this in my mailbox.

817
00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:12,000
You weren't actually in Cuba.

818
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,000
They're going to say that because there's no proof here.

819
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:15,000
There's no proof I'm actually.

820
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,000
Oh, wait, there is a number down there.

821
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:17,000
Do you see that number?

822
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,000
Why don't you look that number over and tell me what that means.

823
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,000
Was there a postmark on any of your postcards, Bernie?

824
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:24,000
The number is your zip code.

825
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:25,000
No, I really don't remember.

826
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:27,000
It was put there by the United States Postal Service.

827
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:28,000
Say it again, Mike.

828
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:30,000
The number in the lower left is your zip code.

829
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:32,000
It was put there by the U.S. Postal Service.

830
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,000
Why would they need to do that when my zip code was written nicely?

831
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:36,000
Well, of course, they covered it with tape too.

832
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,000
I don't know what these people are doing.

833
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:42,000
Okay, here is some more interesting mail from listeners.

834
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,000
And I'll throw number 202-209-2900.

835
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:47,000
We'll be taking phone calls in about five minutes or so.

836
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,000
Dear OffTheHook, I don't know if you know this already,

837
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:51,000
but maybe you could mention it.

838
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,000
It applies to UK listeners.

839
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:56,000
The ID Cards Act was introduced earlier this year.

840
00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:59,000
If you renew your passport as soon as possible,

841
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,000
it means you don't have to have an ID card until 2016.

842
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:04,000
That's right.

843
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:09,000
So if you renew it soon after they start doing this,

844
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,000
I guess you'll wind up with one.

845
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:14,000
So you'll have a 10-year extension on your privacy.

846
00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:17,000
It's sad that we have to think that way, but that's how it is right now.

847
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:20,000
P.S. I'm still awaiting a T-shirt and mouse mat from a donation I made

848
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,000
while you were on the air a few weeks ago.

849
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,000
Signed, John, from Newcastle upon Tyne.

850
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:26,000
Yes, sorry about the delay.

851
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:30,000
I understand that the wheels are moving now.

852
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:32,000
The problem was with communication.

853
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,000
You should have gotten it in May, actually.

854
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:36,000
It's been ready to be mailed.

855
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:40,000
We've just been trying to get verification that the people actually paid the pledges,

856
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:42,000
and that's the only thing we've been waiting for.

857
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:44,000
Everything has been packaged up and ready to go.

858
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:47,000
Those of you who I know pledged for Hope tickets,

859
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:50,000
you're obviously concerned about that as the conference gets closer.

860
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:53,000
You should have it by next Wednesday, by the show next Wednesday.

861
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,000
If you do not, email us, let us know.

862
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:58,000
That doesn't mean email us on Monday and tell us you don't have it.

863
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:01,000
Email us on Wednesday because that's how long I think it might take

864
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:03,000
for you to actually get them.

865
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:04,000
There's people mailing now.

866
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:05,000
No, don't mail now.

867
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,000
Mail next Wednesday if you don't have your tickets

868
00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:09,000
and you pledged for them for Off the Hook.

869
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,000
Simple, right?

870
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:12,000
Okay.

871
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:13,000
I'm confused.

872
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,000
Yeah, I'm right where I belong.

873
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,000
Let's see what else here.

874
00:43:17,000 --> 00:43:19,000
Oh, yeah, I've just heard your latest podcast

875
00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:22,000
and thought you might be interested to know that here in Ireland and the UK,

876
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,000
Ireland especially, the word arse is a very common term for, well,

877
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:32,000
buttocks, bum, ass, rear, whatever you want to call it.

878
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,000
I know that you Americans also call it fanny,

879
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:36,000
but that means something else over here as well.

880
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,000
It's just really funny to email an arse.

881
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:40,000
Signed, Stephen.

882
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:42,000
Well, arse, arsony here.

883
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:46,000
People were emailing you, I believe, for film information about the Hope conference.

884
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:47,000
Is that right?

885
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,000
Should they feel embarrassed about that?

886
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:49,000
It's not one big joke?

887
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:50,000
No, no.

888
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:54,000
Actually, I usually respond to the people that emailed me,

889
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:57,000
so they know that it's real sometimes.

890
00:43:57,000 --> 00:43:58,000
Okay.

891
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:00,000
Well, I mean, that's a real name in Russia.

892
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:05,000
My full name is Arsony, and I like to have a nickname of arse,

893
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,000
and if it's offensive to you, I'm sorry.

894
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:11,000
Well, I mean, in Russia, lots of people have this name, right?

895
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,000
Well, not that many people, but.

896
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:14,000
A fair amount.

897
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:16,000
More than here, that's for sure.

898
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:17,000
Yeah.

899
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:18,000
Okay.

900
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:23,000
They have, like, John over there means arse or something.

901
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:26,000
I mean, do they have, does it work the other way at all?

902
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:27,000
I don't know.

903
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:31,000
How do you say arse in Russian, just for the education of the listeners?

904
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:33,000
Will we get in trouble from the SEC?

905
00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:35,000
Not if it means the same thing that arse means here.

906
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:36,000
Okay.

907
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:37,000
It's arsopa.

908
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:38,000
Okay.

909
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,000
I don't know anybody named that, but that's a good name.

910
00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:41,000
Okay.

911
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:42,000
There you go.

912
00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:43,000
Who says we don't cover everything here?

913
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,000
Dear Off the Hook, I think you guys are off base with the net neutrality issue.

914
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:48,000
The government needs to stay out of it.

915
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:52,000
What I would like is a bill to disallow any government regulation of the internet.

916
00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:56,000
You invite the government into your industry, and it will exert more and more control as time goes on.

917
00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:02,000
It's amazing to me how this issue turned into the government getting involved when, in actuality,

918
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,000
we're trying to prevent big business from taking over.

919
00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:08,000
And the only way to prevent big business from taking over, we can't stop them.

920
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:14,000
We can't stand in front of their doors and keep them from ruining the internet and making it into a big pay service

921
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:18,000
where only the rich people will be able to get their mail delivered in a timely fashion.

922
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:19,000
No.

923
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:20,000
We have to get bills and legislation passed.

924
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:21,000
It's the only way to do it.

925
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:27,000
And yet, I guess that means government gets involved, but it's only because of the misbehavior of the big corporations.

926
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,000
Is that clear enough?

927
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:30,000
Yeah.

928
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:31,000
It's like, you know, with-

929
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:32,000
You agree with me?

930
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:33,000
Yeah.

931
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:34,000
Hard to believe.

932
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:35,000
It's like laws against murder and stuff.

933
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:38,000
I mean, you know, the government is involved.

934
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:39,000
Yeah.

935
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:43,000
I don't want the government poking around my life, but if somebody takes a pot shot at me,

936
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:44,000
you know, I want them punished.

937
00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:45,000
Mm-hmm.

938
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:47,000
I don't want to have to go after them myself.

939
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:49,000
What if he's got bigger guns than me?

940
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:50,000
Okay, you mentioned guns.

941
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:51,000
Guns is another example.

942
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:53,000
When people say, I don't want the government taking my guns away.

943
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:54,000
No, it's not the government doing it.

944
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:56,000
It's the other people around you that want you to get rid of them.

945
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:57,000
I don't want them taking my guns away.

946
00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:58,000
Well, they're the people.

947
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,000
They're the people that don't want you to be shooting around the neighborhood.

948
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:01,000
But I don't want you having a gun.

949
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:02,000
You, in particular.

950
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:03,000
Well, it's okay.

951
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:04,000
I'm a convicted felon.

952
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:05,000
I don't want you, Mike, having a gun.

953
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:06,000
I don't want anybody in this room having a gun.

954
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,000
There should be no guns in the studio.

955
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:10,000
This is not Hot 97, you know.

956
00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:11,000
That sounds fair.

957
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:12,000
All right.

958
00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:13,000
My mind is my weapon.

959
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:14,000
Okay, shall we take some phone calls?

960
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:15,000
209-2900.

961
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:16,000
Yes, Walter?

962
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:18,000
I'm pretty sure the power falls off quadratically,

963
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:21,000
not as 1 over r to the 4th power,

964
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:23,000
because otherwise energy is not conserved.

965
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:24,000
I said quadratically.

966
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:25,000
Oh, you said quadratically.

967
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:27,000
1 over r squared for gravity.

968
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:28,000
Rewind the tape.

969
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:29,000
Did Bernie say that?

970
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:30,000
Yeah, he did say it quadratically.

971
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:31,000
Yeah, it was Bernie.

972
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,000
Technically, exponentially is correct.

973
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:34,000
Bernie may be.

974
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:35,000
There is an exponent involved.

975
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:36,000
The exponent is 2.

976
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:37,000
Exponentially is not right.

977
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:41,000
Though the fields go as 1 over r squared.

978
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,000
Walter, you're giving a talk, I believe,

979
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:44,000
at the HOPE Conference.

980
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:45,000
Yes.

981
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:46,000
I'll go over all of this.

982
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:47,000
What is your subject?

983
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:49,000
I'm going to be talking about quantum cryptography

984
00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:51,000
and quantum computation.

985
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:54,000
I know something about physics.

986
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:56,000
Being a physicist, I would imagine you do.

987
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:57,000
Yes.

988
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:58,000
Good.

989
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:00,000
Okay, well, that's just one of many talks.

990
00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:03,000
The schedule will be posted in the next day or so

991
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,000
on the website, www.hope.net.

992
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,000
So if you're considering going based on the schedule,

993
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,000
keep looking at that,

994
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:12,000
and I think you'll be convinced

995
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:14,000
that this is going to be really amazing.

996
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:15,000
A lot of panels on phone freaking,

997
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:18,000
computer hacking, cryptography,

998
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:20,000
all sorts of subject matter, anything.

999
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:21,000
Cooking.

1000
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:23,000
Even hacker cooking, if you can believe that.

1001
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,000
It's simply amazing.

1002
00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:28,000
Bernie, I think there's something on ham radio, too, right?

1003
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:29,000
Not just ham radio,

1004
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:31,000
but all means of radio communications

1005
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:34,000
that you can use to get yourself out of a jam

1006
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:37,000
if, you know, what hits the fan

1007
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:39,000
and all the lines go down.

1008
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:42,000
Or if you just don't want to use a communications medium

1009
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:45,000
that corporations are going to hand over

1010
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,000
to Big Brother's data mining project,

1011
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:50,000
there are alternatives.

1012
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:52,000
So that's another thing worth listening to

1013
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:55,000
at the 6th Hope Conference.

1014
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:56,000
Hope No. 6, yeah.

1015
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:57,000
And the Prometheus radio project

1016
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,000
is also going to be on hand,

1017
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:01,000
and they've certainly been very active

1018
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:02,000
in past Hope Conferences,

1019
00:48:02,000 --> 00:48:04,000
and they always draw a great crowd themselves.

1020
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:07,000
How to start your own low-power FM station

1021
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,000
in the United States.

1022
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,000
It is legal, and they will tell you how to do it.

1023
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:12,000
Okay.

1024
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,000
Hope Conference, July 21st, 22nd, 23rd,

1025
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,000
right here in New York City, Hotel Pennsylvania,

1026
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:18,000
www.hope.net.

1027
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,000
And before we take phone calls, our address,

1028
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:21,000
if you want to write to us,

1029
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:24,000
oth at 2600.com.

1030
00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:25,000
Okay, Redbird's not here,

1031
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,000
so who's going to be Redbird this week?

1032
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:31,000
Me? No, I already have enough lines to read.

1033
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:32,000
Why don't you just say his lines?

1034
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:35,000
Arsene, you've just hired yourself to do it.

1035
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:36,000
What am I supposed to say?

1036
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:37,000
You'll see.

1037
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:38,000
Yeah, you'll see.

1038
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:39,000
When we look at you and point,

1039
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:40,000
that's when we need you to do something.

1040
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:42,000
Okay, our address, our mailing address,

1041
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,000
and not enough people send us stuff,

1042
00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:45,000
so we'd like to see more stuff

1043
00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:47,000
in the Off the Hook mailbox.

1044
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:50,000
It's Off the Hook, care of WBAI.

1045
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:54,000
Does that make sense?

1046
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:55,000
It's been so long.

1047
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:56,000
120 Wall Street.

1048
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:59,000
10th floor, New York?

1049
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:00,000
New York.

1050
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:02,000
10005.

1051
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:04,000
You know, we're going to have to start writing this down

1052
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:07,000
because it's just gotten too confusing.

1053
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:08,000
Good evening, you're on the air.

1054
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,000
You wonder why we don't get mail.

1055
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:11,000
Ah, that person left.

1056
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:14,000
Good evening, you're on the air.

1057
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:16,000
Anybody there?

1058
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:18,000
Yeah, I'm curious whether you're familiar

1059
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,000
with this conference that's actually running today

1060
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:23,000
and tomorrow called the C3 Expo.

1061
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,000
No, tell us about it.

1062
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:28,000
They've got some program

1063
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:31,000
called Second Generation RFID.

1064
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:32,000
Okay.

1065
00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:33,000
It looks pretty curious.

1066
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,000
If you poke around, you'll find it.

1067
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:37,000
They do want a fee to go,

1068
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:40,000
but you can get a code and get a free pass.

1069
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:42,000
It looks fairly interesting, unfortunately.

1070
00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:44,000
Where is this located?

1071
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:45,000
At Javits.

1072
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:46,000
Okay.

1073
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:48,000
Redhack, you look perplexed.

1074
00:49:48,000 --> 00:49:49,000
No, I was wondering where it was.

1075
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:50,000
Okay.

1076
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:52,000
Second Generation RFID.

1077
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:53,000
So what exactly does that mean?

1078
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:54,000
Does anybody know?

1079
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:59,000
The conference is called C3 Expo.com.

1080
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:00,000
Okay.

1081
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:01,000
I would imagine, Emmanuel,

1082
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:03,000
that it's an RFID that uses the newer,

1083
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:07,000
longer-range 13.56 MHz frequency

1084
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:09,000
as opposed to the old frequency,

1085
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:10,000
which I think was really low,

1086
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:12,000
like 125 kHz or something.

1087
00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:14,000
It had to be just centimeters away

1088
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:16,000
from the sensor to be picked up.

1089
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,000
The newer frequency is much higher

1090
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,000
and provides longer range

1091
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:23,000
in the order of maybe even yards

1092
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:25,000
or longer if you have really good antennas.

1093
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:29,000
So it makes for more efficient RFID tracking

1094
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,000
of RFID tags, which is good and bad.

1095
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:35,000
The site is a little confusing

1096
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:37,000
about how they're treating it.

1097
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:39,000
Some of the little explanations

1098
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:41,000
of the conference sessions

1099
00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:43,000
seem to be attacking it

1100
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,000
and calling it kind of degenerative

1101
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,000
or calling it anti-competitive or something,

1102
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:52,000
whereas other ones seem to be celebrating it.

1103
00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:53,000
Okay.

1104
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:54,000
Well, thanks for the info.

1105
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:55,000
Maybe we'll send somebody down

1106
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:57,000
to check into this.

1107
00:50:57,000 --> 00:50:59,000
So always something interesting going on.

1108
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:00,000
And we're certainly going to have

1109
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:02,000
a lot of RFID talks at the conference.

1110
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:04,000
That's a big topic.

1111
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:05,000
Okay.

1112
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:06,000
Let's take another phone call.

1113
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:07,000
Good evening.

1114
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:08,000
You know, it's my fault.

1115
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,000
I'm hitting these lines and they move.

1116
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:11,000
They don't stay in the same place.

1117
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:12,000
They hop around.

1118
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:14,000
So I'm hitting them at the late stage

1119
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:15,000
of when they're on that light,

1120
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:17,000
so they move just before I hit them.

1121
00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:18,000
Let's try this one.

1122
00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:19,000
Good evening.

1123
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:20,000
You're on the air.

1124
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:21,000
Go ahead.

1125
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:22,000
Hi.

1126
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:23,000
Hi.

1127
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:24,000
What's up?

1128
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:25,000
Okay.

1129
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:26,000
I have a problem with my...

1130
00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:27,000
For some reason,

1131
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,000
my caller ID is at my house

1132
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,000
is acting kind of strange.

1133
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:35,000
Like, it's changed its name to NotifyMD.

1134
00:51:35,000 --> 00:51:38,000
Well, when the actual, like, words

1135
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:39,000
when they come out,

1136
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:41,000
it's been acting like that for a couple of...

1137
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:42,000
It says NotifyMD?

1138
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:43,000
Yeah.

1139
00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:45,000
Like, it spells it correctly even.

1140
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:46,000
And there's, like, a period after M

1141
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:47,000
and a period after D.

1142
00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:48,000
Now, this...

1143
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:49,000
Wait.

1144
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:50,000
This shows up on your caller ID

1145
00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:51,000
for an incoming call?

1146
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:52,000
Yeah.

1147
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:53,000
For anything from my number.

1148
00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:54,000
And it's really weird.

1149
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:55,000
I was wondering if it's, like,

1150
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:56,000
a prank or something.

1151
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:58,000
Well, are they legitimate phone calls?

1152
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,000
Are you getting calls from real people?

1153
00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:01,000
Yeah.

1154
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:02,000
It's, like, my number.

1155
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:03,000
When I call myself

1156
00:52:03,000 --> 00:52:04,000
from, like, a different number

1157
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:05,000
or from that specific number,

1158
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:06,000
it always gets...

1159
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:07,000
It's always that number.

1160
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:08,000
So, I mean,

1161
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,000
it always comes as NotifyMD.

1162
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,000
Okay.

1163
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:13,000
I'm wondering if your caller ID device

1164
00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:15,000
might be doing something wacky.

1165
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:17,000
What kind of caller ID device

1166
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:18,000
do you actually have?

1167
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:19,000
I'm not sure.

1168
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:22,000
It's something with Optimum Voice.

1169
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:23,000
Okay.

1170
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:24,000
You might want to, first of all,

1171
00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:25,000
call them and ask them

1172
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:27,000
if they're familiar with that phrase.

1173
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:29,000
And failing that,

1174
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:31,000
get another caller ID device,

1175
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:32,000
whether it be a phone

1176
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:34,000
or just a standalone device

1177
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:35,000
or even a computer

1178
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:36,000
that records this information,

1179
00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:39,000
and see if that phrase shows up as well.

1180
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:43,000
As far as changing caller ID information,

1181
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:44,000
that's generally done

1182
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:45,000
on a call-by-call basis,

1183
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:46,000
and there's no way

1184
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:47,000
somebody could change it

1185
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:49,000
if you were making the phone call.

1186
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:50,000
Emmanuel?

1187
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:51,000
Yes.

1188
00:52:51,000 --> 00:52:52,000
Go ahead, Bernie.

1189
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:53,000
Even less expensive

1190
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:54,000
than getting another caller ID unit

1191
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:55,000
and testing that

1192
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:57,000
is to take her caller ID unit

1193
00:52:57,000 --> 00:52:58,000
and move it to another phone line,

1194
00:52:58,000 --> 00:52:59,000
like at a friend's

1195
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:00,000
or relative's house

1196
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:01,000
or somewhere else in your building,

1197
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:03,000
and make a call to it then

1198
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:05,000
and see if it still says that.

1199
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:06,000
If it doesn't,

1200
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:07,000
then there's something wrong

1201
00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:08,000
with the caller ID data

1202
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:09,000
on your phone line,

1203
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:10,000
and you need to talk

1204
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:11,000
to Verizon or whoever

1205
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:14,000
your local exchange carrier is about that.

1206
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:15,000
Okay.

1207
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:16,000
All right.

1208
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:17,000
Is that helpful?

1209
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:18,000
Yes, that's it.

1210
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:19,000
Thanks.

1211
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:20,000
All right.

1212
00:53:20,000 --> 00:53:21,000
Let us know what happens.

1213
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:22,000
212-209-2900 is our phone number.

1214
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:23,000
It sounds to me

1215
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,000
like it's trying to tell her

1216
00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:25,000
to call a doctor.

1217
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:26,000
Well, no, obviously,

1218
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:27,000
but if the caller

1219
00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:28,000
doesn't want to call a doctor,

1220
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,000
they shouldn't be forced to.

1221
00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:31,000
The question is why.

1222
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:32,000
I don't understand

1223
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:33,000
any caller ID device

1224
00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:34,000
that would do that,

1225
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:35,000
but I'm sure our listeners

1226
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:36,000
have heard something about this,

1227
00:53:36,000 --> 00:53:37,000
so if you have an answer,

1228
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:38,000
write to us.

1229
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:39,000
Maybe it's broken

1230
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:40,000
and it needs some help.

1231
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:42,000
Good evening.

1232
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:43,000
You're on the air.

1233
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:44,000
Oh, yes.

1234
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:45,000
I wanted to ask you a question.

1235
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:46,000
It's a telephone question,

1236
00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:47,000
kind of.

1237
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:48,000
I had a number

1238
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:49,000
that the same number

1239
00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:50,000
used to belong

1240
00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:51,000
to a construction company

1241
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:52,000
years ago,

1242
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:55,000
and I suddenly got a bill

1243
00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:58,000
that was meant for them

1244
00:53:58,000 --> 00:53:59,000
on my bill.

1245
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:00,000
Okay.

1246
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:01,000
And I called up Verizon,

1247
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:02,000
and Verizon says

1248
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:04,000
that if the FCC made a law

1249
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:06,000
that says that if somebody

1250
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:08,000
decides to pass this along

1251
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:09,000
to your number,

1252
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:10,000
they have to pass it

1253
00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:11,000
along to you,

1254
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:12,000
and the weird thing is

1255
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:14,000
that that's not my name.

1256
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,000
It's a construction company name,

1257
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:18,000
so I figured they would check

1258
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:19,000
the information against

1259
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:20,000
whose name is on the bill

1260
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,000
and the account number,

1261
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:23,000
because we would have

1262
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:24,000
different names

1263
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:25,000
on account numbers.

1264
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:26,000
You're saying that

1265
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:27,000
they used to have

1266
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:28,000
your phone number?

1267
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:29,000
Yes.

1268
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:30,000
All right,

1269
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:31,000
and there was a period of time

1270
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:32,000
where they disconnected

1271
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:33,000
their number,

1272
00:54:33,000 --> 00:54:34,000
and then you connected.

1273
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:35,000
There's usually a gap

1274
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:36,000
between phone numbers

1275
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:37,000
before different people

1276
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:38,000
use the same number.

1277
00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:39,000
Right.

1278
00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:40,000
So somehow,

1279
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:41,000
are you getting billed

1280
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:42,000
for things that they're doing now

1281
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:43,000
or things that they did

1282
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:44,000
in the past?

1283
00:54:44,000 --> 00:54:46,000
They had some kind

1284
00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:48,000
of a directory listing.

1285
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:49,000
Okay.

1286
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:51,000
I forget the name of the company,

1287
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:52,000
because I can't make it

1288
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:53,000
across the room right now,

1289
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:56,000
but it was a directory listing,

1290
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:57,000
and the weird thing is

1291
00:54:57,000 --> 00:54:58,000
people are still calling me

1292
00:54:58,000 --> 00:54:59,000
and asking for that company.

1293
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:00,000
Okay, so it's still...

1294
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,000
So they're still listed.

1295
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:03,000
Yeah, okay.

1296
00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:04,000
Is that the only thing

1297
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:05,000
you're paying for,

1298
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:06,000
is the listing?

1299
00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:07,000
Well, the thing is

1300
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:08,000
I disputed that.

1301
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:09,000
I called up,

1302
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:10,000
because they said

1303
00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:11,000
it was for...

1304
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:12,000
You know,

1305
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:13,000
the name of the company

1306
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:14,000
was Wright Construction Company.

1307
00:55:14,000 --> 00:55:15,000
Right, right.

1308
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:16,000
And that's not my name.

1309
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:17,000
So, like I said,

1310
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:18,000
I asked them,

1311
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:19,000
do they check

1312
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:20,000
for the account numbers

1313
00:55:20,000 --> 00:55:21,000
and the names?

1314
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:22,000
And they said no.

1315
00:55:22,000 --> 00:55:23,000
I have an answer.

1316
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:24,000
Bernie, Bernie, go ahead.

1317
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:25,000
I think that

1318
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:26,000
the directory listing

1319
00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:27,000
business office

1320
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:28,000
has a whole separate

1321
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:29,000
billing system

1322
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:30,000
than the Verizon

1323
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:31,000
telephone number

1324
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:32,000
telephone number

1325
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:33,000
that they have

1326
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:34,000
in their directory.

1327
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:35,000
Okay.

1328
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:37,000
Telephone number...

1329
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:38,000
Telephone services

1330
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:39,000
billing office.

1331
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:40,000
Are you talking

1332
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:41,000
to the Verizon

1333
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:42,000
that handles

1334
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:43,000
your phone bill,

1335
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:44,000
or are you talking

1336
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:45,000
to the Verizon

1337
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:46,000
business office

1338
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:47,000
that handles

1339
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:48,000
what is it,

1340
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:49,000
a Yellow Page ad

1341
00:55:49,000 --> 00:55:50,000
or something?

1342
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:51,000
Yeah.

1343
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:52,000
Yeah, talk to the

1344
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:53,000
Yellow Pages people

1345
00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:55,000
at Verizon,

1346
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:56,000
because it's

1347
00:55:56,000 --> 00:55:57,000
their billing system.

1348
00:55:57,000 --> 00:55:59,000
It's their screw-up.

1349
00:55:59,000 --> 00:56:00,000
Yeah, but why

1350
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:01,000
should he have to do that?

1351
00:56:01,000 --> 00:56:02,000
Why can't his local

1352
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:03,000
business office help him?

1353
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:04,000
Because they're clueless.

1354
00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:05,000
Well, yeah, but they're

1355
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:06,000
also the ones

1356
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:07,000
sending him the bill.

1357
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:08,000
No, they're not.

1358
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:09,000
No, no, no, they're not.

1359
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:10,000
Wait, is this coming

1360
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:11,000
on your regular bill

1361
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:12,000
or a different bill?

1362
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:13,000
It's coming on my

1363
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:14,000
regular bill.

1364
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:15,000
All right, then.

1365
00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:16,000
So the people

1366
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:17,000
who are sending that bill,

1367
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:18,000
they're the ones

1368
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:19,000
that are accountable.

1369
00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:20,000
You tell them that

1370
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:21,000
you got the wrong

1371
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:22,000
listing in there,

1372
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:23,000
you bozos,

1373
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:24,000
you have to fix it.

1374
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:25,000
The Yellow Pages

1375
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:26,000
people are sending

1376
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:27,000
the information

1377
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:28,000
to the Verizon

1378
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:29,000
business office

1379
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:30,000
for the telephone

1380
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:31,000
because, gee,

1381
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:32,000
it's more convenient

1382
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:33,000
to get one bill.

1383
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:34,000
Yeah, but it's their

1384
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:35,000
problem to fix it.

1385
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:36,000
He simply has to

1386
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:37,000
contact the people

1387
00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:38,000
that send him the bill.

1388
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:39,000
The point is, morally

1389
00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:40,000
and legally,

1390
00:56:40,000 --> 00:56:41,000
there's no way

1391
00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:42,000
that this customer

1392
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:43,000
should be responsible

1393
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:44,000
for a listing that

1394
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:45,000
A, isn't his,

1395
00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:46,000
and B, doesn't belong

1396
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:47,000
to that phone.

1397
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:48,000
Yeah, and be

1398
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:49,000
insistent about this.

1399
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:50,000
Make sure that they

1400
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:51,000
credit you for all

1401
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:52,000
the months you've

1402
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:53,000
been paying for this.

1403
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:54,000
Well, because I

1404
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:55,000
don't even know

1405
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:56,000
how long.

1406
00:56:56,000 --> 00:56:57,000
This just happened

1407
00:56:57,000 --> 00:56:58,000
and I had to go

1408
00:56:58,000 --> 00:56:59,000
backtrack a little.

1409
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:00,000
But they said,

1410
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:01,000
I said that I have

1411
00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:02,000
a different name

1412
00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:03,000
and a different

1413
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:04,000
account number.

1414
00:57:04,000 --> 00:57:05,000
So didn't you

1415
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:06,000
check that information

1416
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:07,000
instead of just

1417
00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:08,000
passing it along?

1418
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:09,000
And they said,

1419
00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:10,000
no, it just got

1420
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:11,000
passed along

1421
00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:12,000
as per the number.

1422
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:13,000
That's a little weird,

1423
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:14,000
isn't it?

1424
00:57:14,000 --> 00:57:15,000
Yeah, you know,

1425
00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:16,000
who can say how

1426
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:17,000
they actually managed

1427
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:18,000
to screw this up?

1428
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:19,000
But I actually did

1429
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:20,000
talk to the

1430
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:21,000
listing company

1431
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:22,000
and they said

1432
00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:23,000
they were going

1433
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:24,000
to take it off,

1434
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:25,000
but it hasn't

1435
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:26,000
come off yet.

1436
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:27,000
All right, well,

1437
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:28,000
you just got to

1438
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:29,000
keep on them

1439
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:30,000
and make sure

1440
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:31,000
that they do this

1441
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:32,000
and don't fail to.

1442
00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:33,000
And then call the

1443
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:34,000
Public Service Commission

1444
00:57:34,000 --> 00:57:35,000
and say,

1445
00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:36,000
this is outrageous,

1446
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:37,000
what they're doing

1447
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:38,000
is simply

1448
00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:39,000
illegal, wrong,

1449
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:40,000
and causing you

1450
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:41,000
all kinds of

1451
00:57:41,000 --> 00:57:42,000
anxiety and grief.

1452
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:43,000
Let us know how

1453
00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:44,000
it turns out.

1454
00:57:44,000 --> 00:57:45,000
Thanks for your call.

1455
00:57:45,000 --> 00:57:46,000
We're out of time.

1456
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:47,000
We had a lot of

1457
00:57:47,000 --> 00:57:48,000
people ask what this

1458
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:49,000
was when we

1459
00:57:49,000 --> 00:57:50,000
played it last week.

1460
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:51,000
It's Evolution

1461
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:52,000
Control Committee

1462
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:53,000
with a little bit

1463
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:54,000
of remixing

1464
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:55,000
and hopefully

1465
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:56,000
nothing that will

1466
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:57,000
cause copyright issues.

1467
00:57:57,000 --> 00:57:58,000
But then again,

1468
00:57:58,000 --> 00:57:59,000
everything does

1469
00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:00,000
these days.

1470
00:58:00,000 --> 00:58:01,000
See you then.

1471
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:32,000
You know what I'm saying?

1472
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:33,000
You know what I'm saying?

1473
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:34,000
You know what I'm saying?

1474
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:35,000
You know what I'm saying?

1475
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:36,000
You know what I'm saying?

1476
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:37,000
You know what I'm saying?

1477
00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:38,000
You know what I'm saying?

1478
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:39,000
You know what I'm saying?

1479
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:40,000
You know what I'm saying?

1480
00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:41,000
You know what I'm saying?

1481
00:58:41,000 --> 00:58:42,000
You know what I'm saying?

1482
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:43,000
You know what I'm saying?

1483
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:44,000
You know what I'm saying?

1484
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:45,000
You know what I'm saying?

1485
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:46,000
You know what I'm saying?

1486
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:47,000
You know what I'm saying?

1487
00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:48,000
You know what I'm saying?

1488
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:49,000
You know what I'm saying?

1489
00:58:49,000 --> 00:58:50,000
You know what I'm saying?

1490
00:58:50,000 --> 00:58:51,000
You know what I'm saying?

1491
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:52,000
You know what I'm saying?

1492
00:58:52,000 --> 00:58:53,000
You know what I'm saying?

1493
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:54,000
You know what I'm saying?

1494
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:55,000
You know what I'm saying?

1495
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:56,000
But then I'm positive

1496
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:57,000
Some say I'm negative

1497
00:58:57,000 --> 00:58:58,000
But then I'm positive

1498
00:58:58,000 --> 00:58:59,000
Some say I'm negative

1499
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:00,000
No

1500
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:01,000
Negative

1501
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:02,000
No

1502
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:03,000
Some say I'm negative

1503
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:04,000
But then I'm positive

1504
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:05,000
Some say I'm negative

1505
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:06,000
But then I'm positive

1506
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:07,000
Some say I'm negative

1507
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:08,000
But then I'm positive

1508
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:09,000
Some say I'm

1509
00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:10,000
No

1510
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:11,000
No

1511
00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:12,000
But then I'm

1512
00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:13,000
Yes

1513
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:14,000
Yes

1514
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:15,000
Yes

1515
00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:16,000
Say no

1516
00:59:16,000 --> 00:59:17,000
Yes

1517
00:59:17,000 --> 00:59:18,000
Yes

1518
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:19,000
Say no

1519
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:20,000
And run home to tell your mom or dad

1520
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:21,000
Yes

1521
00:59:21,000 --> 00:59:23,000
It's okay to say no

1522
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:24,000
No

1523
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:25,000
Negative

1524
00:59:25,000 --> 00:59:26,000
No

1525
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:27,000
Yes

1526
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:28,000
Say no

1527
00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:29,000
One

1528
00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:30,000
Yes

1529
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:31,000
Yes

1530
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:33,000
It's okay to say no

1531
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:34,000
No

1532
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:35,000
Negative

1533
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:36,000
No

1534
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:37,000
Yes

1535
00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:38,000
No

1536
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:39,000
Yes

1537
00:59:39,000 --> 00:59:40,000
No

1538
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:41,000
Yes

1539
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:43,000
Learn how to say no

1540
00:59:43,000 --> 00:59:45,000
Loud and clear

1541
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:46,000
No

1542
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:47,000
No

1543
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:48,000
No

1544
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:49,000
No

1545
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:50,000
No

1546
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:51,000
No smoking

1547
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:54,000
Here, smoking is absolutely prohibited

1548
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:58,000
If you try again, it's always handcuffs for you